Frustrated/I hate MPS!!

[Spiderman]

Well my wife and I went to use the tub tonight and when we opened the cover, the water was very cloudy and stunk like dead bodies!!  I checked and no one was laying dead on the bottom, so I knew it was the water      For the first couple of weeks with the tub, I followed Hot Spring's instructions and was using MPS; 1 TBS after each use and shocking with 1 1/2 tsp of dichlor once/week.  About two weeks ago I noticed the water was starting to get a little cloudy.  I read some posts here and most seem to be using dichlor as their daily sanitizer, so I thought I'd try that.  I used dichlor for a couple of days and the water cleared up      Two days ago, I went back to the MPS and now I have a cesspool (sp?)  I shocked the crap out of it with dichlor tonight and I am hoping for the best.  What else should I do to bring the water back to usable again?  Also, after each time I shock it, I get nasty brown gunk around the tub where it foams up.   Is this normal??

[Garyjr]

Spiderman,

I had very similar water conditions using the same method you described and ended up changing the water.  I am sure you can keep shocking it with dichlor and get it to clear up, but from the advise I was given, it is cheaper, easier and alot quicker to drain and refill.  I am now sanitizing and shocking with dichlor and will only use MPS when the CC climbs to high.

Good luck,
Jr

[In Canada eh]

Spiderman,

    Switch back to dichlor as your primary sanitizer!

I don't understand the use of MPS as your daily routine(maybe others can explain) I my opinion,  MPS is an oxidizer and not a sanitizer. Dichlor used in small amounts is a effective sanitizer and in larger amounts can be used as a sanitizer.  The method that everyone around here(Vermonters) is tryed and true and works quite well.  As for the cloudy water you have now it should clear up in about 24 hours.

[Vinny]

Spiderman,

    Switch back to dichlor as your primary sanitizer!

I don't understand the use of MPS as your daily routine(maybe others can explain) I my opinion,  MPS is an oxidizer and not a sanitizer. Dichlor used in small amounts is a effective sanitizer and in larger amounts can be used as a sanitizer.  The method that everyone around here(Vermonters) is tryed and true and works quite well.  As for the cloudy water you have now it should clear up in about 24 hours.

I agree 110%

I see that people here use MPS on a regular (daily) basis that way and it has been suggested to me to use it that way when using N2 but I'll take dichlor over MPS as a daily thing.

Use dichlor and if you shock once in a while with MPS - all should be fine!

[hottub.pool_boy]

Spidie,
    Ever heard of EverfreshWater Care. If you'd like, send me a PM. Tell me which spa model you have, give me a fax #, or email and I'll have a custom sheet sent right over to you before the weekend's out. Let me know what you think.

[Razzman]

I followed Hot Spring's instructions and was using MPS; 1 TBS after each use and shocking with 1 1/2 tsp of dichlor once/week.

I've been doing just the opposite as per the experts here recommended and have had no issues since getting the tub a month ago.

[Wisoki]

Yeah, it should be realy quite simple. Small chlorine doses after each use and a once a week dose of shock (mps). This will keep your water nice and clean and the weekly shock will oxidize any excess contaminents causing the chlorine to convert to inactive chloramine, or bromine to inactive bromamines. The 1 x a week shock converts them back to chlor and brom. To keep things simple here is how I instruct my customers after fill and initial balance...

After each use or last use of the day add 2-3 Tbsp. Chlor.
Once a week check your pH and alk, make what ever small adjustments as needed, and shock once a week. This will keep your water clean and inviting.

Use defoamers, enzymes and clarifiers ONLY when needed, otherwise you are overloading your water with TDS.

Relax and enjoy!

I followed Hot Spring's instructions and was using MPS; 1 TBS after each use and shocking with 1 1/2 tsp of dichlor once/week.

I've been doing just the opposite as per the experts here recommended and have had no issues since getting the tub a month ago.

[Reese]

After each use or last use of the day add 2-3 Tbsp. Chlor

I assume you mean teaspoons?

[Wisoki]

Nope, Tbsp. = Tablespoons tsp. = teaspoons.

After each use or last use of the day add 2-3 Tbsp. Chlor

I assume you mean teaspoons?

[Reese]

That's a lot of chlorine!   Even in a large tub, that would be a 10+ ppm dose.  The consensus seems to be that 3-5 ppm is enough, unless you are doing a shock or battling an infection.  I understand the point of your post was to keep it simple, and that it is better to use too much than not enough, but IMO that sounds like too much.

[Wisoki]

How much chlorine does it take to maintain 3-5ppm? The point of my post, as you pointed out, was to keep things simple. However, let me go further into it. You cannot maintain 3-5 ppm with out a chlorine feeder, therefore, when adding chlorine after the use of the spa, add enough to kill all the creepy things that come off of your body and thrive in a moist warm environment. The addition of 3 tablespoons with a 3 or 4 minute off gassing is sufficient to kill all, and allow you to come back to fresh clean water, in which virtually all the chlorine has been used, and you get to soak in almost pure water. Try my method with 3 teaspoons, you water will turn on you and fast.

That's a lot of chlorine!   Even in a large tub, that would be a 10+ ppm dose.  The consensus seems to be that 3-5 ppm is enough, unless you are doing a shock or battling an infection.  I understand the point of your post was to keep it simple, and that it is better to use too much than not enough, but IMO that sounds like too much.

[Reese]

How much chlorine does it take to maintain 3-5ppm? The point of my post, as you pointed out, was to keep things simple. However, let me go further into it. You cannot maintain 3-5 ppm with out a chlorine feeder, therefore, when adding chlorine after the use of the spa, add enough to kill all the creepy things that come off of your body and thrive in a moist warm environment. The addition of 3 tablespoons with a 3 or 4 minute off gassing is sufficient to kill all, and allow you to come back to fresh clean water, in which virtually all the chlorine has been used, and you get to soak in almost pure water. Try my method with 3 teaspoons, you water will turn on you and fast.

That's a lot of chlorine!   Even in a large tub, that would be a 10+ ppm dose.  The consensus seems to be that 3-5 ppm is enough, unless you are doing a shock or battling an infection.  I understand the point of your post was to keep it simple, and that it is better to use too much than not enough, but IMO that sounds like too much.

We really aren't in disagreement on anything other than how much chlorine is needed to do that job.  I used to use 2 tablespoons after soaking (9 ppm in my tub) and that worked fine, but I've been using a 3-5 ppm dose (2-3 tsp in my tub) for a long time, and my water doesn't turn on me.  With lower doses, my CYA doesn't build up as fast and I can go 5 months between water changes using the tub on average 3 times/week.  The only posts I've seen on this topic that are backed by science are the "Vermonter" system on rhtubs.com, and his findings are similar to my experience -- If you achieve enough free chlorine to kill what you leave behind in the tub, it will last 2-3 days before it needs more chlorine.  Now, I do use N2 in addition to provide a cushion for missed/inadequate doses.  That may help me get by with a little less chlorine, too.  I see lots of posts by others using ozone instead of N2 with similar results.

p.s.  I was just thinking, I keep my pH around 7.3 which allows more chlorine to be more effective than higher pH.  Perhaps that explains our difference of opinion.  What pH do you recommend to your customers?

[tonyp]

Two years now following the freshwater system as explained by my dealer without a complaint.  

N2 and ozone

Shock with 3 tablespoons of dichlor once a week with S2 oz. scale and stain the next day.

2 tablespoons of MPS before each use.

filters cleaned monthly or as needed in the dishwasher.

The only other thing I add is Ph- whenever I get a chance since my Ph and TA are always high.

The closest that I have had to a water problem was the one time I forgot to use the freshwater in-line filter on a refill (every 4 months).  Had to clean the filters every couple of weeks for a while.

BTW I never measure chlorine level since it's alway 0 except after a shock.

[Amanda_Panda]

How much chlorine and mps you use deends on how many people use the spa, for how long, and how often according to the gallons the spa holds. Typical directions from the chlorine (dichlor) bottle will state something like 1/2 or 1tsp/ hundred gallons as an initial dose but if that doesn't get the water into the 3-5 "ok" range then you repeat that same dosage every 15-20 minutes to get the desired outcome. I would make sure you do not overdose the spa all at once... too many chemicals apllied too quickly can cause the water to be corrosive (potentially harming your spa/equipment) or you may be having to work harder in the long run with more water changes than you need due to the saturation point being reached faster.

[Bill_Stevenson]

Listen children, go to www.rhtubs.com and get the Vermonter's water treatment program and follow it.  Everyones' tub is a little different.  Follow the Vermonter's advice and figure out how much dichlor to add to your spa after each use to bring the chlorine up to 3-5 ppm.  It will be one or two teaspoons for most of us.  Once a week shock with about  5x-7x the daily dose.  I don't personally use MPS, but it would be OK to use it for shock instead of dichlor.

Using more dichlor than this is neither necessary, nor responisible.  Chlorine is a powerful halogen and not environmentally friendly.

Regards,

Bill