hs envoy vs sd cameo

[lilcesar]

hello i need help deciding on which tub. hs 9600 sd 9000. cant wet test wife is to shy. which has better warranty, insulation, power bill, quality etc. do you really float with a lounger. also what about cleanliness and supplies. i just need help please

[drewstar]

Hi lilcesar,


Both Hotsprings and Sundance have very good reputations. I don't think you can go wrong with either brand.

These two tubs are very similliar (IMHO), virtually the same size, jets, water capacity.  The pumps on the Sundance are slightly more powerful (2.5 hp vs 2.o hp). The HS pumps are 2 speeds, while the sundance pumps areonly single speeds.  However, I think these differnces are so slight, it's negligable.

Both are insualted with full foam and once again, I feel the same.

Since the pumps on the HS are smaller, you might save a couple of pennies a month in electrical. Maybe.


Loungers...some people float, some dont.   This is based on body mass/size/height weight/position.  A wet test would answer this.

The Hotsrpings tub offers the moto massage. This is HS exclusive jet system. On the Envoy it's in the lounger seat. Some folks love the moto, while other dont.  ((The words "wet test" are forming on my lips again.   )


The sundance tub has air blowers. The HS does not.  The air blower adds air bubbles to the jets for a more intense masage. Some folks like it. Some don't. (the bubbles make me itchy).  Once again, a wet test would tell you what you prefer.

To split hairs, running the air jets in freezing temperatures will cool the water, causing the heater to work more, so if absolute top heat effciency was your utmost concern, nix the bubbles. However, it's a rather small point.


The Hotsrpings tub comes standard with an ozone system. I feel these are great and would recomend one. The Sundance tub has an ozone system as an option.  I would see if, when pricing the tubs, if the ozone is included in the sundance.

The HS tub recomended sanitizer is Dichlor. Sundance incorporates an inline bromine system. Both systems are good.  I prefer dichlor, but thats just my prefeerance. And if you wanted you could use either dichlor or bromine in these tubs.


I would really really push you to wet test and choose the tub you feel fits the best.  If your wife is too shy, then I would suggest you go, and you choose the tub you feel is a better fit.  

Also to consider is the deal. Price.  Price for the tub, cover, steps, lifter, delivery and ozoniator.  

Check out the dealer, (references, BBB) and how comfortable you are with them.  A bad dealer can make the experince a nightmare.


Also, you have numbers posted after the tubs 9600 and 9000.  Are these the respective prices? Is this US dollars?

If so, I think both those prices are very high.

[sledjunkie]

I can't believe what people are paying for hot tubs..

shop around you can do better than that, maybe start looking at other brands as well..

I just bought an Artesian Opal, with 34 Jets(stainless) Full foam, Ozonator, 3 pumps, plus one circ pump. It also has a 5 year warrenty on parts and labor.
I paid thousands less than your quote of 9000+

Am I missing something? Why are HS and Sundance so expensive?

[drewstar]

Also, the HS includes Ozone and the breaker box,  when talking with sundance, see if they are including these in the price, or factor it in.  I'd say the ozone and box are worth about $400.  

[Chris_H]

Most people don’t wet test so don’t sweat it.  For whatever reason, 99% of the people on these forums wet test, but 99% of most buyers do not wet test.  Trust me on that one.

I don’t think the prices are high because most dealers are getting those prices for those tubs.  Ask Term/Chas what they sell the Envoy in their stores.  Guaranteed it is right around $9,500 give or take $500.  Here in Philly, I have seen it at around $9,300 with the normal options.    For the Cameo, it sells around $9,700 here in Philly with the regular options.

If the options you will be receiving and your comfort with the dealer were the same I would buy the Sundance based on price alone.  

However, if you are receiving these specific items with the Hotspring:  Everwood Steps, Navigator Remote, and the Hotspring Cover Cradle – the Hotsrping would be my recommendation.  Doubtful that they are, but it is worth asking.  

[hottubdan]

Why are HS and Sundance so expensive?

Quality components.
Workmanship.
Status.
Reputation.
Dealer network.
Customer Service.
You get what you pay for.

In most markets, Sundance and Hot Spring have dealers who have been in business for years, selling the same brand for years.  Often other dealerships come and go or change brands year to year.

Why are other tubs so cheap?

[rick]

"Am I missing something? Why are HS and Sundance so expensive? "


To pay for all that marketing.

[Spatech_tuo]

cant wet test wife is to shy.

which has better warranty, insulation, power bill, quality etc. do you really float with a lounger. also what about cleanliness and supplies. i just need help please

Is your wife too shy to allow YOU to wet test? Go in yourself and see if it helps you decide. Otherwise, both are very well made spas and you'll find happy owners of each brand.

[lilcesar]

yes i am probalby going to wet test . the number after the tubs are prices in dollars. we live in northern california thse are the only dealers except for cal spas. i dont think cal spas are the best. thanks

[sledjunkie]

Quality components.
Workmanship.
Status.
Reputation.
Dealer network.
Customer Service.
You get what you pay for

Sorry guys, but IMO this is a bunch of sales and marketing crap. If you believe that than you have bigger problems.

I suppose the reason they could be so expensive is the manufacturer is charging dealers too much, so it's trickling down to the consumer.

[hymbaw]

The sundance tub has air blowers. The HS does not.  The air blower adds air bubbles to the jets for a more intense masage. Some folks like it. Some don't. (the bubbles make me itchy).  Once again, a wet test would tell you what you prefer.

To split hairs, running the air jets in freezing temperatures will cool the water, causing the heater to work more, so if absolute top heat effciency was your utmost concern, nix the bubbles. However, it's a rather small point.
 

The air blowers on a Sundance DO NOT add air bubbles to the water jets. The air is introduced by separate "air injector" jets.

The temperature of the the water will drop when running a blower on most tubs.
NOT A SUNDANCE! Sundance brings the air through the motor that is powering the blower to heat it. The air being injected into the tub averages 120 degrees.

[hymbaw]

To pay for all that marketing.

I've seen the TV ads for HotSpring. Please tell me what "marketing" you are refering to from Sundance.

[drewstar]

The air blowers on a Sundance DO NOT add air bubbles to the water jets. The air is introduced by separate "air injector" jets.

The temperature of the the water will drop when running a blower on most tubs.
NOT A SUNDANCE! Sundance brings the air through the motor that is powering the blower to heat it. The air being injected into the tub averages 120 degrees.

Thanks for the correction.

[hymbaw]

If so, I think both those prices are very high.

Not so. I have my Cameos priced at $9500 and I know a lot of dealers that get more for them.

 I know Pontiacs get you to work and back, have four wheels, and an engine, a warranty, a dealer network, etc. but you shouldn't compare the sticker prices to Mercedes and BMW.

[drewstar]

Not so. I have my Cameos priced at $9500 and I know a lot of dealers that get more for them.

  I know Pontiacs get you to work and back, have four wheels, and an engine, a warranty, a dealer network, etc. but you shouldn't compare the sticker prices to Mercedes and BMW.

And I know some folks who got them for 2K less.

http://www.whatsthebest-hottub.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=wtb-hottub;action=display;num=1145489262;start=7

at that price, it sure doens't hurt to look around.