PRICING NEGOTIATIONS?????

[Steve]

WAS hoping if the "FORUM" could tell me if a SPA price quoted from a dealer is negotiable, and if so, by how much.

Obviously, I'm very new to the SPA world.  What should I look for in a spa's features and/or specifications, Fully insulated vs. thermal paned , low circulation pump vs. 1/4 horse ? etc,etc,etc!!!
It's a jungle out there :^)

Thanx in advance,
Steve

[Eric]

Yes most dealers have price negotiating built into their spas.  Probably in the $200-$400 range.  If a spa is listed at MSRP there will certainly more than that.  I believe that full insulation is the only way to go. (you can check previos posts for reasons) Also, the low amp circulation pump is indeed a good idea although not necessary it will help with water clarity and efficiency.  Goood luck in the jungle.

[Linda]

I own a "Therma Spa" and they are great spas.  I re-searched and re-searched until I was crazy with information.  I wouldn't buy a full foam spa if someone gave it to me. first of all if there is a leak it's hard to find, they have to drain your spa then re-fill with colored water then re-drain it again.. who would want to waste that much time.  With a Therma spa the insulation part stays at 100 degree is sure saves on your electric bill.  Since buying are I've found many people to own it and they say it's the best.. well I don't know if it is or isn't for everyone I just think you have to get the one that is right for you... oh yeah they took $1000.00 off our.
Happy soaking

[Steve]

hi Linda,
thanx for the response, obviously full or no foam is certainly an issue in this forum, a forum i'm very new to.

Have you realized your first electric bill yet with the Thermo-Spa???

Like you, I have picked up a tremendous amount of information in a very short period of time, and am not afraid to say. . . Completely Confused" over the entire market of Hot Spas.

Gut instincts will probably win out!!!

was repair problems the only reason given to purchase a Non Foam unit ?

[SpaSalesMan]

What Linda forgot to add is that the water is heating the equipment area at 100 degrees f and thats losing a lot of heat.  She will have electrical bills in the 100 dollar a month range and as for service, you'll see her posts for help shortly, since she has no labor coverage on the warranty.  This is the same person who stated she was buying a Marquis because the Microban shell killed bacteria and eliminated chemical use. She has not taken delivery yet and will wait a few months to do so.  Also she stated that she bough factory direct and saved a lot, then in the next sentence she said she paid more foor the spa.This is exactly who you do not want to listen to when making a purchase decision.  She wouldnt be making these posts if she felt she made a good decision, who knows, mysery enjoys company!

[Kathleen]

While appreciating your opinion on fully foamed vs. thermal pane spas, I find your remarks about Thermo Spas unfounded.  Laura may have an electric bill in the $100 a month range, but that will be due to her usage normally.  Her increase of bill will not be $100 more than she is paying now. On a Thermo Spa $20 would be a stretch unless she had something mis-wired.

You are also choosing an adhominum attack of the consumer to prove her wrong.  Thermo Spa has a proven name in the market and because some non professional puchased for reasons of her own (which differed from yours), that does not change the reputation and durability of the spa.  I do not sell Thermo Spas, but would never say that purchasing one would show poor judgement.

I believe in thermal pane over fully foamed as an insulation method.  It's proven as seen in our own home insulation methods, but understand how some people could be misled into believing fully foamed is better.  It seems that in theory fully foamed spas should insulate better, it's just not on the right side of the spa as 80% of heat loss is through the top of the spa.  

Fully foamed spas also insulate the heat generated from the pump away from the spa, wheras a thermal paned spa will utilize this heat.  And after 10 years of ownership, fully foamed spas are disgusting to work on.  The openings in the cabinet allow moisture in.  The freezing of the foam and cracking of the spa is not always caused by a leak and many times is the result of a harsh winter on a winterized spa turned off for the season.  If a repair person hasn't seen this happen, they aren't in a cold climate or haven't done enough repairs as it's commonplace in fully foamed spas.

On a personal note, I found your post to be demeaning and a flame.  Let's get back to helping consumers and not our own egos.

Happy Tubbing

[Kathleen]

While appreciating your opinion on fully foamed vs. thermal pane spas, I find your remarks about Thermo Spas unfounded.  Laura may have an electric bill in the $100 a month range, but that will be due to her usage normally.  Her increase of bill will not be $100 more than she is paying now. On a Thermo Spa $20 would be a stretch unless she had something mis-wired.

You are also choosing an adhominum attack of the consumer to prove her wrong.  Thermo Spa has a proven name in the market and because some non professional puchased for reasons of her own (which differed from yours), that does not change the reputation and durability of the spa.  I do not sell Thermo Spas, but would never say that purchasing one would show poor judgement.

I believe in thermal pane over fully foamed as an insulation method.  It's proven as seen in our own home insulation methods, but understand how some people could be misled into believing fully foamed is better.  It seems that in theory fully foamed spas should insulate better, it's just not on the right side of the spa as 80% of heat loss is through the top of the spa.  

Fully foamed spas also insulate the heat generated from the pump away from the spa, wheras a thermal paned spa will utilize this heat.  And after 10 years of ownership, fully foamed spas are disgusting to work on.  The openings in the cabinet allow moisture in.  The freezing of the foam and cracking of the spa is not always caused by a leak and many times is the result of a harsh winter on a winterized spa turned off for the season.  If a repair person hasn't seen this happen, they aren't in a cold climate or haven't done enough repairs as it's commonplace in fully foamed spas.

On a personal note, I found your post to be demeaning and a flame.  Let's get back to helping consumers and not our own egos.

Happy Tubbing

[SpaSalesMan]

Lets hook up an electrical meter on a full foam and thermopane spa.  The winner will take the others spa.  I am more than happy to travel to where you are and bring my personal spa for the test. As for Lori, I believe that she was misleaded by her salesperson, and is on here stating hogwash as fact, Microban, Tinfoil foam, and yes I feel thats personal. I make this sincere bet if you will on insulation.  Put both spas in a cold climate and lets see it work!  Oh by the way, homes now use solid foam insulation, depending on the climate in the area they are being built.  You dont keep a house 104 degrees year round. Explain to me how the dead air space in a thermopane spa is heated.  Do you know how real thermopane insulation works in windows? It radiates heat from uv light and uses a gas to transfer heat.So are you stating that your spa is transparent? Lets do the test and find out, Ill look forward to having a spa for parts.

[Kathleen]

Since you wish to have technical testing done, why don't you contact the ASTM.  Trading for pink slips doesn't prove anything except for unprofessionalism, so there is no interest by me to participate.

Since you seem to not mind taking the time and money, why not buy the tub and do the research and submit it for everyone to read.  The industry doesn't have enough testing for standards and any little thing helps.

A bit of warning though, you must exclude any variables which is the main reason why what seems so simple to do - isn't........

Hope this helps.
Happy Tubbing.

[Rich]

You're both making something simple overly complex.  Forget about spas.
I ask you, when is less insulation better than more insulation?  Never if your object is to maintain a temperature.

Again, forget about spas.  What else do you own that maintains a temperature.  Try your fridge.  Fully insulated, isn't it?

How about your coffee thermos?  Dead air space?  No, that's just what everyone thinks and the salesman uses it to his advantage.  Ask your grandfather what they originally called a Thermos bottle.  It was called a vaccum bottle.  That is because the space in between is void of air so there will not be a heat transfer or heat LOSS.  Yes indeed,
if spas COULD be made like a vaccum bottle, they WOULD be better than full foam spas.

By the way, I HAVE owned both kinds.  My original spa was not fully insulated.  My current one is.  I would estimate that my current spa saves me about $10 a month in cost vs. my old one.  Not as much as I expected but it still adds up.  Neither spa has ever had a plumbing leak, something I attribute to the quality of the manufactures more than anything else.  

[Rayman]

6 years later and nothing has changed

[drewstar]

6 years later and nothing has changed

Why are you resurecting this ?   This should be locked or "dead horsed"

[cappykat]

Back to the poster's original question.  Yes, you can negotiate.  Just like buying a car...offer/counter offer.  Good luck.

[drewstar]

Back to the poster's original question.  Yes, you can negotiate.  Just like buying a car...offer/counter offer.  Good luck.

Post was made in 2000. They probabaly have settled thier negotions.  They are just waiting for delivery.  

[Rayman]

Sorry Drew, I couldn't resist.  Moderator please feel free to move or remove.

Ray