still fighting with ph

[orlandoguy]

I recently started using the Taylor kit to get a better ph reading and still have trouble maintaining a good ph.  According the the store, getting the alk right is the first step, which i did.  Over the course of three days, I used nearly a full bottle of ph down and still can't get too the "ideal" reading which I think is 7.4, right?

The guy says i might be worrying too much and as long as it is not bright red in the kit and under 8.0, I should be happy.  Anyoe agree?

[windsurfdog]

If you are using dichlor, it will continue to decrease slowly since dichlor's 7.0 pH will lower it over time.  As we swapped posts about before, use unbuffered MPS to shock with and its 3-4 pH will bring it down even quicker.  I would agree that anything below 8 is ok as long as it continues to drop slowly.  And consider this:  If you have it too basic for a period of time, allow the pH to drop to around 7.0 or so which will cause any calcium buildup that may have occured during the high pH time to be returned to the water.  This is the route I take when after changing my water.  After a couple of days in the tub, my new water will be 8.0+ but I won't use any acid--just dichlor and MPS.  After a couple of shocks over the period of 2 weeks or so, the pH is usually just about 7.4.  I'll let it drop on down for a week or so and then bump it back up with soda ash to around 7.4 or so.  Remember, water balance is like horseshoes and hand gernades......close counts.

[orlandoguy]

good theory, but does this apply to bromine.

[tonyp]

Mine may take a month to settle even with some PH- since my alkalinity is so high.  I just take it sloq.  For some reason after my last water change the PH read low.  I ignored it and the next morning it was 8+.  Maybe just a bad reading.

[orlandoguy]

I was reading about a new chart and theory that says you do less maintainance with chemicals and enjoy less itching if you run a higher alk, as well as having ph easier to maintain, I forget the name of the chart but need to try it.

[Soakin]

...For some reason after my last water change the PH read low.  I ignored it and the next morning it was 8+.  Maybe just a bad reading.

My water always acts that way.  It reads perfect out of the tap, but by the next day it shows high pH and TA, and doesn't come down without a lot of dry acid.  I haven't tried WSD's program, but it sounds good, providing your water is not too hard.  Otherwise I would fear scale buildup.

[hymbaw]

O-GUY,

   Bromine is less affected by ph swings than chlorine, so as far as sanitizing you'll be OK. I would keep trying to get the ph down around 7.4. High ph can cause problems over time.

good luck

[orlandoguy]

Yeah.  I keep thinking of trying that stuff that locks the ph in at the correct levels once you get it right.  I think you need to do it right after a drain and refill and since I am only a month into this fill, i will wait.

Funny how it was perfect for so long and went bad like a stepchild on drugs.

It might also be that the taylor kit is giving better readings than the strips were.  I am currently around 8.0 so I guess it could be worse.

[ssmtim]

Good Morning

For what it's worth, we have used Bromine in our Beachcomber since new 3 years ago.  The Dealer told us that Bromine will bring the ph down over time and we have found this to be true.  We find that we have to use ph-up monthly to raise the ph and then it will gradually fall.

I think that if you wait, the ph will drift downward - this is a slow process - you may have to wait a week or so to see much change.

Good luck

Tim

[windsurfdog]

good theory, but does this apply to bromine.

ssmtim said:

For what it's worth, we have used Bromine in our Beachcomber since new 3 years ago.  The Dealer told us that Bromine will bring the ph down over time and we have found this to be true.  We find that we have to use ph-up monthly to raise the ph and then it will gradually fall.

Sounds like bromine's pH is comparable to dichlor's pH....good to know.  Being a dichlor guy, I'm clueless re: bromine.  Thx ssmtim.

If MPS is an acceptable shock for bromine, I'd try the unbuffered stuff as suggested.  Good luck!

[Soakin]

Sounds like bromine's pH is comparable to dichlor's pH

I believe Bromines pH is even lower.   I'm thinking 6 or so, but don't remember for sure.

[tony]

Bromine actually has a pH of about 2.  pH should naturally drift down with bromine.  Have you tried the acid demand reagents in your Taylor kit.  They will tell you exactly how much dry acid you need to get it where you want.

[Soakin]

Bromine actually has a pH of about 2.

Tony's number sounded a little low to me, so I checked Doc's handy "sanitizer comparison" page.  He says bromine's pH is 3.5-4.5.  I'm guessing that pure bromine would have a pH of 2 as Tony says and the bromine tablets that everyone uses are higher due to the dichlor and other inert ingredients.  Regardless, it is still pretty acidic and will bring your pH down over time.

[orlandoguy]

Time seems to be the big thing.  The bottle says to add an ounce at a time and keep rechecking every half hour until it gets to the acceptable level.  After nearly a bottle with very slow results, I am going to see what happens after my normal Sunday shock, which i was experimenting doing every two weeks, possibly causing this recent rise in ph.  Also, a recent addition to our family has caused the tub to be used by someone besides just me, another possible cause.

I am going to try the ph lock after my next drain just to see if it is all it claims to be.

[Soakin]

...The bottle says to add an ounce at a time and keep rechecking every half hour until it gets to the acceptable level.  After nearly a bottle with very slow results...

A lot of people wait until the next day to check pH, because it can take a quite awhile for the dose to affect test readings.  You said your TA was OK.  What has been happening to it with all the dry acid?  Since the TA acts as a ph buffer, the TA usually moves first.

FYI, my high TA/high pH water takes about 24 oz of dry acid to get the pH down to 7.5, so I add big doses the first few days, going to an ounce at a time when the TA gets in line and the pH finally starts to move.