Dimension One Question for Dealers.

[stuart]

I'm not a D1 dealer, and I don't play one on TV. But I sell HotSpring spas, and they offer a white thermoplastic shell. It is not harder to live with. This material is not porus like a fabric or other product - so it doesn't absorb stains. If it shows dirt more, most peopl find that to be a plus: if you can see the dirt, you can wipe if off. If you can't see it, it gets into the water and clouds things up.

No matter what color you end up with, you are not going to want to let dirty people around it or in it....

I'm a D1 Salesman but have played a HotSpring salesman on TV!

Chas buddy,
Remember the old day's when all we had to sell was white spas? And these guy's think they have it tough!

[Chas]

Yup yup yup.

In fact, I remember Ivory. "the water looks a little green."
"It's supposed to look that way."

Oh yeah.

[Top_Cat]

Three comments:

1 "LifetimeWarranty" = 7 years in most states;

2 The "Dynamic Sequencer" on the Chairman II consists of solenoid valves housed in fragile plastic (every one of them leaked in my showroom and had to be fixed). The regular Chairman is a better buy IMO.

3 The white shell will help you see the condition of your water better than a colored shell.

[stuart]

Three comments:

1 "LifetimeWarranty" = 7 years in most states;

I'm sorry to hear that you have to go to the state government to handel your warranty claims. I've never seen D1 deny a claim that was valid yet! BTW, the terms of the warranty change after 7 years and is, in sense, not the same warranty so you would have a prosecutable claim if it really did come down to that. Also, what does the brand you sell offer after 7 years?

2 The "Dynamic Sequencer" on the Chairman II consists of solenoid valves housed in fragile plastic (every one of them leaked in my showroom and had to be fixed). The regular Chairman is a better buy IMO.

The "Dynamic Sequencer" is basically a series of sprinkler valves that are used in every yard in the country. Sounds like we should all expect a sudden failure of our sprinkler systems soon! Oh and the last time I looked, the Sequencer valves were attached to the shell not the “cheap plastic housing” and had a polymer shroud around them for protection. What did you expect the shroud to be made of, Titanium? I've sold around 100 of them this year alone, I have between 25 and 30 spas on my showroom floor at any given time, at least 3-5 of which are full and most of those have "Dynamic Sequencer" seats. I did have a Lotus Bay leak this year on the floor but it turned out to be a drain valve one of my guy's installed wrong.

D1 offers a 60 day unconditional replacement to any dealer that has a leak in the plumbing in the first 60 days and follows the terms of the warranty from there on out!  

I personally like the regular Chairman and the Californian – same power package, less jets, less plumbing, more intense!

3 The white shell will help you see the condition of your water better than a colored shell.

On this point, we agree.......

[HotTubMan]

You gettem tiger!

[suzieq]

That was the main reason I asked my question.

I printed out the D-1 warranty and actually read it ! It says that the Lifetime warranty tub after 7 years has to be shipped back to the factory (in California I think) for repair or replacement. ALL shipping costs are paid for by the customer.

The Granitex tubs come with the same 7 year warranty. But after the 7 years, you pay for the repair as well. You still have to ship it to the factory and pay the shipping both ways. So what's the big advantage? I don't pay for the repair? So what. If the cost to repair is that great, then it would probably be better to buy another one anyway since shipping (from east coast to west coast) is going to be out of this world anyway and probably not worth having the repair made whether it's covered or not.

That is why I was hoping for a lower price on the non lifetime material. The warranty is basically the same for both.

[Top_Cat]

On the sequencers that leaked in my showroom (all of them, as I said) I found that the factory had over-torqued one or more of the mounting screws cracking the plastic which caused the leaking. This could just have been a bad batch of spas -- Diplomats and Chairman IIs.

The factory refused to pay for the new carpeting, so I dropped the D1 line several months ago and am selling Catalina spas which have had no factory defects and no customer complaints (over 200 sold).

[poolboy34]

hmmmmmmmmm.....call me crazy, but last i checked the diplomat DOES NOT come with the Dynamic Massage sequencer.  And I can't ever recall having a sequencer leak on one of our show room floors.  And considering that the selenoid valves are fastened with unions, I find it difficult to believe that the "mounting" screws were overtorqued.  

As for the limited lifetime warranty - here's the skinny.  D-1 also has a sub-plant in Ohio.  This is where the spas would be shipped after 7 years IF there was a problem with the shell.  The dealership I work for has been on board with D-1 for 18+ years, and in that time they've only had ONE spa with an ultralife shell develop a leak.  The customer paid the freight one way to ohio, then D-1 sent them a NEW spa at no extra charge to the customer, and this was after the 7 year period was up.  

[stuart]

That was the main reason I asked my question.

I printed out the D-1 warranty and actually read it ! It says that the Lifetime warranty tub after 7 years has to be shipped back to the factory (in California I think) for repair or replacement. ALL shipping costs are paid for by the customer.

That’s right, after 7 years shipping costs are paid by the customer. Let's create a hypothetical situation here, you by a new spa and it works fine for 7 years suddenly you go out and there are a million little cracks or blisters or it's turned orange or whatever, your $7000 spa is ruined! But wait, you bought a D1 with UltraLife! Now you can replace the entire tub for around $500 of shipping! How cool is that? Guess what you would do with most other brands after that scenario? We just did a foam dig on an older spa from a very respected manufacture to repair a crack on the shell from the back of the shell. The cost of this is going to be close to $800 and it could crack again, it's still the same old spa. Had it been a D1 with UltraLife it would have been replaced!

There is something with spa materials called "Micro Crazing" that can cause hundreds of tiny fractures in the shell. It's not all spas but the potential exists for all spas and I've seen it a lot in my years in the industry, especially if the bar top is exposed to the sun for long periods. When this happens you cannot repair it so your out of luck. I kinda think it's nice that a manufacture gives me the piece of mind to not worry about things like that.

The Granitex tubs come with the same 7-year warranty. But after the 7 years, you pay for the repair as well. You still have to ship it to the factory and pay the shipping both ways. So what's the big advantage? I don't pay for the repair? So what. If the cost to repair is that great, then it would probably be better to buy another one anyway since shipping (from east coast to west coast) is going to be out of this world anyway and probably not worth having the repair made whether it's covered or not.

That is why I was hoping for a lower price on the non-lifetime material. The warranty is basically the same for both.
 

I hope that I've established the fact that it is not the same warranty. Understand that if your spa has to go back and all they need to do is fix it as opposed to replace it they make sure you get your moneys worth. They recondition the entire spa!

[Mark_Vee]

Very Well Stated!!

[salesdvl]

Remember the old day's when all we had to sell was white spas? And these guy's think they have it tough!

I remember when we used to take a filter lid and whack it on the spa shell to demo the strength.  Boy, the good ole' days.  

[stuart]

I remember when we used to take a filter lid and whack it on the spa shell to demo the strength.  Boy, the good ole' days.  

Are you an old "Dog Dish" warrior too? Actually your probably younger.....we used baseball bats before that!

[suzieq]

Hey Stuart relax....................I am meerly asking some questions. And since most people do not read the warranty they are suprised when "Lifetime" doesn't exactly mean "Lifetime". Also, the warranty says that the tub will be repaired or replaced at D-1's discression so you can not say that the tub will be replaced with a NEW one 100% of the time.

Anyway, we are wet testing tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

Sue.

[HotTubMan]

Hey Stuart relax....................I am meerly asking some questions. And since most people do not read the warranty they are suprised when "Lifetime" doesn't exactly mean "Lifetime". Also, the warranty says that the tub will be repaired or replaced at D-1's discression so you can not say that the tub will be replaced with a NEW one 100% of the time.

Anyway, we are wet testing tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

Sue.

What you say here is true to some degree, but the fact is acrylic is never covered longer than 7 years by any manufacturer. When and if it does need repair after that you are on your own 100%. At least D-1 will fix it if you get it to them. As Stuart and Poolboy stated it still MIGHT NOT cost you anything.

BTW, I know CalSpa has 10 years on acrylic, but I think we all know how easy it is to get that fixed......

HTM

[stuart]

Hey Stuart relax....................I am meerly asking some questions. And since most people do not read the warranty they are suprised when "Lifetime" doesn't exactly mean "Lifetime". Also, the warranty says that the tub will be repaired or replaced at D-1's discression so you can not say that the tub will be replaced with a NEW one 100% of the time.

Anyway, we are wet testing tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

Sue.

:-[Sorry, didn't mean to sound so intense over that! Just wanted you to have the right train of thought on the warranty.

If you read the little quote next to my name it says, " common sense is not so common" - I truly believe that we overlook the obvious so often because we're looking for something deeper that doesn't exist. Have a great wet test and if nothing else, notice the warm, leather like feel of the UltraLife as opposed to the cold hardness of the acrylic.