Bullfrog technology

[Racenut]

I see jet pacs as a gimmick to sell tubs. No one ever buys extra. After a little while they never change them around. Seems to me if your buying a BF you had better wet test because what if it feels lousy, all the jet pacs, no matter where you put them. Or maybe buy all of them. Or just buy what the dealer steers you to.

Dude, they aren't baseball cards.  Nobody is trying to turn buying and trading JetPacks into a hobby. 

And "if your buying a BF you had better wet test because what if it feels lousy"...really?  How is that any different than any other tub made?  You say that like you expect it to be terrible... it's not.  But with other tubs it's take it or leave it.  BF gives you OPTIONS.  So far the only downside to JetPacks you've actually come up with that might have a shred of merit is it might take some more effort to clean the extra surfaces. Not a big deal in my book.  I'm not sure which JetPack mistreated your sister, but it's obvious you don't like any of them.  Seriously, not even the Neck Masseuse? That one is so awesome we got two of them so we don't have to share the best jets in the tub.  Do that with any other tub...

[Dr. Spa™ Ret.]

The majority of the time, it's just me using the spa...sometime maybe a girlfriend will join me. Why the hell would I want all the turbulence, noise and extra expense of operating ALL the jets at the same time?

Also, there's absolutely nothing technological about BF's jet packs...it's just another way of doing something that's been done for decades in spas....jets, and plumbing.

[Jacuzzi Jim]

 There are obviously people that do not like it and that's fine.   Then there are those that are more open minded and get the concept.  It's a different way to build a spa and it's not gimmicky.  It's very functional and offers way more "options" for therapy than the old off the shelf spa.   Not every spa or jet is going to fit or hit that one person just right.  The jet packs do give better options for those looking to personalize their hot tub to what suits them. 
   Instead of the conventional spa that just is here you go like it or not.  Oh the jets don't hit you right in that seat?  Well that's what we have and you can't change it, but hey it has pretty lights and a waterfall.       
 
  The way Bullfrog has exploded onto the market they must be doing something right.     A year ago or more, Bullfrog was not even on anybody's radar.   

[dporter22]

Yes MarKee, as a matter of fact getting maximum power at every seat actually is a good argument because it's true.  It doesn't "appear" that you are getting maximum power, you are getting it.  And the jet packs do not restrict the flow as you incorrectly stated. 

As I explained, every seat in a BF has maximum flow (or you can adjust each seat as you like individually).  You don't have to mess with diverter valves which sacrifice power at some seats just to get full power at only one seat, which you seem to think is an advantage.  What about the people sitting in those other seats who also want full power?  Too bad for them if they're not in a BF.

That's the beauty of the BF design, every seat can choose exactly the amount of power they want from full to nothing without forcing other seats to have or less.

So if you turn all but one seat off the flow stays the same in that seat?  That's impossible.  Bullfrog's have divereters like most other spas they are just in a different spot

I didn't discuss turning off all the seats except one; that's an irrelevant point since the whole purpose of a spa is to have all the seats on so people can enjoy them.  Of course the flow to one seat would increase if you turned everything else off, but why does that matter?  My point was that everyone can enjoy full power at their seat, or less if they want, without sacrificing power at another seat, which no other spa can do they way BF does because they all force you to divert flow from one seat in order to get max flow at another.

I'm not saying that other spas don't have sufficient power, or aren't quality spas, or don't have nice features, or that BF is the only way to go.  I'm simply explaining that a nice feature of a BF is that the design allows for individually adjustable power at each seat and that you don't lose a significant amount of power at one seat to get more power at another.

I tested several other brands and every time they would say, "Ok, sit in this seat and I'll adjust the diverter so you can get full power".  Then I would say, "Great, now keep me at full power and let my wife feel full power at her seat too".  And all the salesman would start making excuses about why they couldn't do that, or I would never really want full power at more than one seat, or just fiddle around with all these diverter settings to get some sort of balance of medium power, etc.

If that works for someone, great.  For me the BF system made much more sense.

Then it's not full power at every seat if you turn divertors and more flow goes to other seats.  Glad you are enjoying your Tub.  BF absolutely makes a fine product and are a top of the line spa.  Hope you have many trouble free years with it

Yes, as I clearly explained, every seat has full power.  And you don't turn diverters like on other spas which decrease power at some seats to send it to others, you simply adjust individual seats to your liking without significantly affecting the other seats.  That's what people who haven't tested a BF don't understand because they're accustomed to compromising and dividing power amongst their seats. 

The pumps, plumbing, and design of the jet packs allow for full power at all the seats simultaneously and then you can individually turn seats down if you want.  And yes, as I already explained, when you turn down several seats the flow will increase a little at the other seats.  So the power at those seats would go from 100% to 110%, which then you could turn down if you wanted back to 100%.   (The "extra" flow from turning several seats way down is also routed to the various foot, hip, wrist, and other permanent jets.)  Nobody has to have less power so somebody else can have full power.

[Tman122]

I see jet pacs as a gimmick to sell tubs. No one ever buys extra. After a little while they never change them around. Seems to me if your buying a BF you had better wet test because what if it feels lousy, all the jet pacs, no matter where you put them. Or maybe buy all of them. Or just buy what the dealer steers you to. To me it's not technology, it's a gimmick to help sell a tub that's nothing more than, well OK? The pacs and the way they are mounted look clunky to me. There's more surface to clean when you clean your tub. And I cleaned mine a lot.

There's a whole lot of better tubs out there in my opinion. And whoever said 10 years, it better be longer than that. Great tubs last 20 or more.

And I don't care for the HS moto massage either. After 20+ years of ownership of different brands I like a certain feel and neither BF or HS give it to me. I would hope everyone finds there "feel" and are not steered to a brand because of some gimmick.

Big and Clunky? I'd get a refund from your eye doctor if I was you :-)

-

I said "Clunky" Not big and clunky. I went out and looked for flashy photos of other brands with fewer seems, less bumps and choppy curves but couldn't figure out how to copy and post. You can go find your own. Maybe it's not my eyes but a different eye.

[Tman122]

  Instead of the conventional spa that just is here you go like it or not.  Oh the jets don't hit you right in that seat?  Well that's what we have and you can't change it, but hey it has pretty lights and a waterfall.   
 

Instead of 100's of different combinations of quality tubs and jets and pumps and dealers. I'd rather have 20-30 jet pacs? I bet a company like HS has more jet combinations than BF. By all means buy one if it's right for you. But technology........that's a stretch.

[Jacuzzi Jim]

 You don't get it and that's alright    nobody says you have to have 30 packs.    If your looking at a 7x7 spa in Jacuzzi you have 4 choices of spas  J-345 J-335 J-245 and J-235 2 are nicer than the other 2 with more features, but the jets are where they are and that's what you get. Same with Sundance and Hot Springs.    With Bullfrog you can choose from 16 different ones and get what you want.  And no most people are not going to buy extras though I have sold them.

 Cool thing was and get this,  I was able to send one or two home with them to try it out to see if they really liked it and if they wanted to try others I could send a different one again.   You can't do that with any other spa.  Why do you think the golf industry came out with changeable driver shafts and adjustable heads? To fit some ones swing.

  IT'S ABOUT PERSONAL CHOICE AND BEING ABLE TO CHOOSE A PACK THAT YOU LIKE IN YOUR SPA.   End of story.     

[Tman122]

Look at the title of the thread.

[av8r]

  Instead of the conventional spa that just is here you go like it or not.  Oh the jets don't hit you right in that seat?  Well that's what we have and you can't change it, but hey it has pretty lights and a waterfall.   
 

Instead of 100's of different combinations of quality tubs and jets and pumps and dealers. I'd rather have 20-30 jet pacs? I bet a company like HS has more jet combinations than BF. By all means buy one if it's right for you. But technology........that's a stretch.

For some reason you have a thing against BF.  No idea why, but you've lost credibility here.  At this point you're just arguing no matter what anyone says. 

in the last week I've suggested BF to 3 couples looking a tubs.  All 3 have ordered a BF tub over the other, older designed tubs. 

BF is doing it right.

[av8r]

I see jet pacs as a gimmick to sell tubs. No one ever buys extra. After a little while they never change them around.

It's a fool who speaks in absolutes. 

[Jacuzzi Jim]

Look at the title of the thread.

Pretty sure we got off that subject line awhile ago.   You wanna keep talking about it, or let it go?   Or does it need to go the way of beating a dead horse?    The technology has been around for a long time. Someone made it better than it was by a long shot and it's pissing some major mfg off big time.   You obviously don't agree with it, and again that's fine.  Honestly you should go take a look at one in person and make a decision about it at that point.   I know you only service spa's as did I at one point in my career.     Are they the best thing since sliced bread?  No.   But they are something different and so far seem to be a really, really good spa and offer something unique from the old cookie cutter design that's available to the consumer.   

    I am done with this now, as it's just going round and round.  Much like so many threads did a few years ago.    I will say dealers are loving the change and it's some thing new compared to the Hot Springs, Jacuzzi and Sundance lines that just up in price and down in quality.    Again the talk about it proves my point.   

[Tman122]

  Instead of the conventional spa that just is here you go like it or not.  Oh the jets don't hit you right in that seat?  Well that's what we have and you can't change it, but hey it has pretty lights and a waterfall.   
 

Instead of 100's of different combinations of quality tubs and jets and pumps and dealers. I'd rather have 20-30 jet pacs? I bet a company like HS has more jet combinations than BF. By all means buy one if it's right for you. But technology........that's a stretch.

For some reason you have a thing against BF.  No idea why, but you've lost credibility here.  At this point you're just arguing no matter what anyone says. 

in the last week I've suggested BF to 3 couples looking a tubs.  All 3 have ordered a BF tub over the other, older designed tubs. 

BF is doing it right.

Just because I don't drink the koolaid does not mean I have anything against Bullfrog. They seem to be OK. I looked at them. I don't get a goo-goo about hot tub gimmicks.

[av8r]

  Instead of the conventional spa that just is here you go like it or not.  Oh the jets don't hit you right in that seat?  Well that's what we have and you can't change it, but hey it has pretty lights and a waterfall.   
 

Instead of 100's of different combinations of quality tubs and jets and pumps and dealers. I'd rather have 20-30 jet pacs? I bet a company like HS has more jet combinations than BF. By all means buy one if it's right for you. But technology........that's a stretch.

For some reason you have a thing against BF.  No idea why, but you've lost credibility here.  At this point you're just arguing no matter what anyone says. 

in the last week I've suggested BF to 3 couples looking a tubs.  All 3 have ordered a BF tub over the other, older designed tubs. 

BF is doing it right.

Just because I don't drink the koolaid does not mean I have anything against Bullfrog. They seem to be OK. I looked at them. I don't get a goo-goo about hot tub gimmicks.

Koolaid?

Credibility = zero

[Tman122]

OK lets talk about credibility. "You get full power at all jet pacs" This is scientifically impossible, it's a sales pitch but a bunch of you have fallin for it, drank the koolaid. If you turn all the power to one jet pac it has the full power of the pump, or as much as the plumbing and friction will allow. The second you turn on another jet pac the first looses power and gives it to the second and so on. The BF I looked at didn't have a pump for each jet pac. That's the only way "full power at all jet pacs" is possible.

So those who say "full power at all jet pacs"= no credibility, just koolaid.

[av8r]

OK lets talk about credibility. "You get full power at all jet pacs" This is scientifically impossible, it's a sales pitch but a bunch of you have fallin for it, drank the koolaid. If you turn all the power to one jet pac it has the full power of the pump, or as much as the plumbing and friction will allow. The second you turn on another jet pac the first looses power and gives it to the second and so on. The BF I looked at didn't have a pump for each jet pac. That's the only way "full power at all jet pacs" is possible.

So those who say "full power at all jet pacs"= no credibility, just koolaid.

You need to think a little more logically.  Full power doesn't mean the full level of pressure/volume available at the pump exhaust.  It simply means that the system is designed to deliver the highest volume and pressure with as few obstacles to each seat.  It's a more efficient design, no one can argue that point.  Do BF sales people push the envelope with how they describe it?  Probably, but we seem to have a generally more discerning group here that can look beyond that and appreciate the differences in the BF design. 

Playing dumb doesn't help anyone, especially newer folks coming here to seek information.  They're looking for an honest discussion with as little noise to signal ration as possible.