After-market salt-water chlorination option.

[NZArtist]

Does anyone have any experience with the ControlOMatic range of salt-water chlorination products?
http://www.controlomatic.com/SaltwaterLineup.pdf
Thanks.

[Sam]

They work fine, but I wouldn't do it.  You likely have component failures due to the salt.  In my experience, people with salt systems experience significantly higher failure rates for heaters, jets and other components.  And all that a salt system does is turn salt into chlorine.  It's not hard to just simply add chlorine to the water, imo. 

[NZArtist]

They work fine, but I wouldn't do it.  You likely have component failures due to the salt.  In my experience, people with salt systems experience significantly higher failure rates for heaters, jets and other components.  And all that a salt system does is turn salt into chlorine.  It's not hard to just simply add chlorine to the water, imo.

The theory is that the salt systems keep the chlorination at a constant level.
With manual chlorination you add a dose once every two or three days. That gives you a spike in chlorine levels. So for one day you have too much, one day you have the right amount, and one day you have too little.  If you're away or forget, you get green water and have to spend a day or two 'rescuing' the spa. 
The *theory* behind the salt water chlorination systems is great.  It's just that the implementation is so tragic.
I wonder if there's a niche for a mechanical system that uses a roll of tape with tablets of chlorine, and another tape of test strips. Once a day a test strip tests the levels, an optical sensor determines the chlorination level, if necessary the other tape advances and drops a tablet into the filter compartment.  Rolls last a year, and otherwise you set it and forget it.

[Dr. Spa™ Ret.]

Drop a tab into the filter and you'll have far MORE issues than with a salt system.

Use an OPR controller and peristaltic pump w/ liquid chlorine....only around $3000 to set up.

[NZArtist]

Drop a tab into the filter and you'll have far MORE issues than with a salt system.

Hotspring owners manual.  Page 50
How to add chemicals to the water
======================
IMPORTANT: All spa water chemicals, including granulated dichlor, MPS, granulated pH increaser or decreaser, granulated total alkalinity increaser, liquid stain and scale inhibitor, and liquid defoamer must always be added directly into the filter compartment while the jet pump is running in its high speed mode, and it must run for a  minimum of ten minutes..
To Administer Spa Water Chemicals:
1) Fold back the cover. Carefully remove and set aside the filter compartment cover
2) Push the CLEAN soft button (on home screen) to turn on the jet pump.
3) Carefully measure the recommended amount of chemical and slowly pour it into the filter compartment. Use care not to splash chemicals on your hands, in your eyes, on the spa shell surface, or on the spa cabinet.
...

Watkins says not to use liquid chlorine, but we're out of warranty so what the hey...

[Jacuzzi Jim]

 You had nothing but problems with salt, if you couldn't get the ACE system to work any other type of product will not be any better.

  Go with a mineral stick (Nature 2)  Little chlorine after use, shock once a week watch PH/Alk. 

[NZArtist]

You had nothing but problems with salt, if you couldn't get the ACE system to work any other type of product will not be any better.

  Go with a mineral stick (Nature 2)  Little chlorine after use, shock once a week watch PH/Alk.

It doesn't need to be better, it just needs to be not worse.  The ControlOMatic cells are half the price of the ACE cells.  If they're just as bad it still saves me a bucketload of dollars.  If they're worse, well then there's no point in looking at them.
So, has anyone tried them?  Anyone heard of them before?

[Dr. Spa™ Ret.]

" jet pump is running in its high speed mode, and it must run for a  minimum of ten minutes"

[Dr. Spa™ Ret.]

" jet pump is running in its high speed mode, and it must run for a  minimum of ten minutes"

Why do you think this is?

[NZArtist]

" jet pump is running in its high speed mode, and it must run for a  minimum of ten minutes"

Why do you think this is?

To ensure the granules are fully dissolved and don't damage the filters or spa. And that the chlorine is fully dispersed into the spa water.
Okay, I should have added "... and puts the spa into clean mode after chlorination..."
Whatever - it was idle thoughts.
Back to the original question - do you know anything about these OEM salt-water cells?

[chem geek]

First of all, the salt level for the ControlOMatic TechniChlor is 2000 ppm, not 3000 ppm found in most U.S. saltwater chlorine generators for swimming pools.  Also note that when manually dosing with Dichlor or bleach the salt level builds up.  For ANY added source of chlorine, for every 10 ppm FC the chlorine becomes 8 ppm salt when the chlorine is used/consumed.  For bleach, there is an additional 8 ppm salt added upon addition while for Dichlor there is 9 ppm CYA added.  So with Dichlor-only using the standard Water Replacement Interval (WRI) and assuming a 350 gallon spa used frequently (i.e. say one person-hour per day) one ends up after 39 days with CYA at 250 ppm and salt at 230 ppm.  Using bleach and ignoring initial Dichlor use, one can go at least twice as long between water changes so around 80 days with CYA maintained and not increasing and ending with salt at 925 ppm higher than one started.  If one does not use the spa frequently, then one can get a higher salt buildup before a water change is required so if one spreads out my bleach example over a year with 1 ppm FC per day extra chlorine usage in between soaks, then that is an additional 470 ppm salt to get up to around 1400 ppm.

Second, is that the system does not dose extra to handle your bather load so by default it is really there just to provide a background dose in between soaks unless you soak almost every day consistently in which case you could turn up its output, but then you'd start your soak at a higher FC level and most people prefer to start low at 1-2 ppm FC to not notice the chlorine so much.  They do have a "boost" mode, but that will obviously only handle a fixed amount of bather load and only does so relatively slowly compared to manual dosing.  So if you use this system with occasional (say, on weekends only) spa use, then you'd mostly use it to maintain the spa in between your soaks and could still add chlorine manually after your soak.

Third, you HAVE to use Cyanuric Acid (CYA) initially and since you may not be soaking enough to use Dichlor enough to build up CYA, you should add pure CYA during startup instead.  If you do not do this, then the active chlorine level will be too high and THAT will be more damaging to equipment (including hot tub covers since much more chlorine will outgas) as well as much harsher on swimsuits, skin, and hair.  So add 30-40 ppm CYA to start out and add about 5 ppm per month thereafter.

Fourth, the ACE® Salt Water Sanitizing System as described in their User's Manual uses 750 ppm salt.  It is not just a chlorine generator, but uses boron-doped diamond electrodes to produce hydroxyl radicals that are very powerful though short-lived oxidizers.  Technically, ozone breaks down into hydroxyl radicals, but also into other super-oxygen species so you can think of the ACE system as a low salt chlorine generator having an ozonator on steroids.

Fifth, as was noted by Dr. Spa if background dosing automation for in-between soaks is the main concern, then you can use a peristaltic pump to dose chlorinating liquid or bleach into the spa, assuming you've added CYA initially first and maintain its level monthly.  If you also wanted to automate the dosing to handle your bather load, then you could add an ORP system as Dr. Spa noted, but these are not generally set up to wait for dosing to after your soak so you may get chlorine introduced during your soak similar to commercial/public pools that try and maintain an FC level at all times.  So you may notice the chlorine more.  Also, ORP systems can be finicky and need periodic recalibration and maintenance.  Peristaltic pumps are very reliable, however.

While higher salt levels increase metal corrosion rates due to the higher conductivity of the water as well as the higher chloride content that affects stainless steel, whether a particular spa is affected depends on the quality of components in the spa.  If less expensive 304 stainless steel is used, the corrosion will be faster than if 316 stainless steel is used.  If a copper heat exchanger is used in the gas heater, then it will corrode faster than a cupro-nickel or titanium heat exchanger.

I've seen quite a few reports on another spa forum of people using the ControlOMatic and it working well for them.  However, whether the corrosion issues will be a practical problem for your spa depends on the corrosion-resistance of your particular spa's components.  Similar corrosion concerns are present for people using saltwater chlorine generators for pools though there is also the additional concern for splash-out salt buildup effects damaging soft stone or concrete in areas with little rain and rapid evaporation.

[NZArtist]

Okay, I'll be the test-case then.
I've ordered one.  It'll be awhile though - shipping to New Zealand can take a few weeks.

You can be sure I'll let you know if it's a horrible thing.

[Isaac-1]

I can't say anything about this product, but I do have a Saltron Mini salt water chlorinator on my 1998 Hot Spring Jetsetter that I bought used about 18 months ago.  Overall it works well, however I have had 2 circulation pumps fail  (the older style circulation pump that came with the tub died 3 days after I installed it, the tub had been stored indoors for a few years when I bought it, so I will blame that for initial pump failute), first E5 circulation pump failed after about 12 months (ceramic bearing that the impeller rides on appears to have cracked), the second one failed about 2 weeks ago with ground fault trips, it has no visible damage.  I don't know if either of these relate to the SWG, or if it was just bad luck on cirulaiton pumps.  The only other failure I have experienced is the light relay on the IQ-2000 control board seems to be stuck on, the simple solution was to unplug the light as I never used it anyway, I really doubt this one had anything to do with salt.

As to the Saltron Mini, overall it seems to work ok, level adjustments are a bit course as they are X hours out of 24, I find with my small 2-3 person jetsetter I run it at only 2-3 hours per day.