What is the Best Hot Tub for Sanitation

[AaronSantaCruz]

I would like to purchase a hot tub that has the very best sanitation system so that I can avoid chlorine and bromine. I have spoken with reps at Hot Springs, Jacuzzi, D1, and ThermoSpas. Everybody tells me they have the best "patented" sanitation system. I am very frustrated. How can I find the truth? Hot Springs has the best reputation. Jacuzzi has a fancy UV system. D1 has an oversized silver disperser. ThermoSpas has the biggest circulation rate. It seems to me that:

1) ozone should have an isolated agitation chamber so that the gas does not escape and should be able to run while the jets are on.
2) the recirculation pump should be high volume
3) there should be an effective ionizer

Is UV better than Ozone? Is there any danger to being exposed to Ozone (which is an irritant)? Do the ionizers emit nano-particles (which may be harmful)? Which is the best brand and product line for sanitation and how can I confirm this?

Thank you to anyone that can help me ease my anguish so that I can finally settle on a hot tub to purchase.

[Tman122]

Hot tubs don't sanitize. Chlorine and bromine sanitize. No matter how you push water around in it a hot tub will not sanitize. Matter of fact it does the opposite. It gathers up all the nasty stuff that comes from our body's during a soak and incubates it in the warm environment to help it grow into bacteria that can be harmful.

No if you add Ozone, UV, Silver Ions and all the other supplements out there, they will help chlorine or bromine sanitize your hot tub. But the tub itself has nothing to do with it.

[chem geek]

There are only four disinfection methods that are approved by the EPA for hot tubs so that pass EPA DIS/TSS-12 with very fast kill rates of many pathogens to prevent person-to-person transmission of disease and that have also been shown to be safe.  These four methods are: chlorine, bromine, Baquacil/biguanide/PHMB, and Nature² silver ions with MPS (potassium monopersulfate aka non-chlorine shock).

UV and ozone and metal ion systems (by themselves) are considered to be supplemental systems only.  In particular, UV and ozone do not leave a residual disinfectant in the spa water so do absolutely nothing to prevent direct person-to-person transmission of disease nor do they do anything to prevent pathogen growth on spa surfaces since they only affect water that passes through their systems (some ozonators produce excess ozone that is not all degassed and so may temporarily disinfect the water in the spa seating area but not when users are in the spa since the ozonator is usually turned off when jets are used or other activity of spa use is detected).

If you do not want to use a halogen-based system such as chlorine or bromine, then you can use Nature² that provides silver ions AND use non-chlorine shock (potassium monopersulfate, MPS) which combined in hot water conditions provides fast disinfection as well as reasonable oxidation.  You can use this in conjunction with either a UV or ozone system if you like.  That would have you use less MPS (especially if you use ozone).  Nevertheless, you will likely need to shock with chlorine every so often, once a week or two or perhaps once a month in order to keep the water clear.  This is because MPS does not oxidize all the same chemicals that chlorine does.

[Sam]

What they are saying is that all of the systems being sold to you require at least some amount of chlorine or bromine. 

Hot Spring sells the ACE system that is a saltwater system.  Saltwater Spas are by very nature Chlorine Spas.  Also, if you do a quick search of these forums, you will see that quite a few people are finding the ACE system to be problematic and very expensive to maintain.

UV and Ozone reduce the amount of sanitizer residual that you need to maintain, but do not eliminate it.  I would not say that either one is necessarily better than the other.  UV bulbs need to be replaced regularly at an expense to you.

There is a lot of B.S. that salesman use to make the sale.  You should probably get used to the idea of needing some amount of Chlorine or Bromine or go with Baquacil, which has it's own set of problems.  There are some here that use Hydrogen Peroxide, but it is not EPA approved and may even void your warranty.

Good luck!  I know it's confusing.

[Tman122]

What they are saying is that all of the systems being sold to you require at least some amount of chlorine or bromine. 

Hot Spring sells the ACE system that is a saltwater system.  Saltwater Spas are by very nature Chlorine Spas.  Also, if you do a quick search of these forums, you will see that quite a few people are finding the ACE system to be problematic and very expensive to maintain.

UV and Ozone reduce the amount of sanitizer residual that you need to maintain, but do not eliminate it.  I would not say that either one is necessarily better than the other.  UV bulbs need to be replaced regularly at an expense to you.

There is a lot of B.S. that salesman use to make the sale.  You should probably get used to the idea of needing some amount of Chlorine or Bromine or go with Baquacil, which has it's own set of problems.  There are some here that use Hydrogen Peroxide, but it is not EPA approved and may even void your warranty.

Good luck!  I know it's confusing.

Thank you Sam. I tried to be nice to our local board sales folks. Most of them here are straight shooters. But it is amazing to me how our buying public can be persuaded by a professional in this industry. And hell, tub company's have a whole departments to make it convincing so no wonder it happens so much.

Aaron find a tub that is comfortable, seems built well with a good reputation, that fits your budget. A reputable dealer and us will help you manage your water. It's easy once you get the hang of it.

[hottubdan]

If you are one of the vast majority that masters the ACE system, you, essentially have a bottled chemical free spa. Anyone who has used a salt spa or pool can tell you the water is objectively and subjectively different.  It is softer. Less odor.

[Dr. Spa™ Ret.]

But it's NOT chemical free! Instead of ADDING chemicals, the spa is manufacturing them right there in the water.

[TwinCitiesHotSpring]

as stated there really is no "best tub" for sanitation, I will say things like 24hr circ pumps, properly sized filter(s), silver ion cartridges are things that can help but as stated your going to be limited by the EPA approved methods if you want to run a nice clean, properly sanitized spa (chlorine, bromine, Baqua, Nature2) we sell a lot of the ACE Saltwater Systems and as long as its sold and setup properly people are liking that as an option.  If saltwater is not an option than the Nature2 is also a very easy alternative that is relatively low chlorine assuming your usage is "average" or below

[AaronSantaCruz]

Thank you everybody for taking the time to help me out to better understand water sanitation. I see now the distinction between filtration and sanitation. It sounds like I can avoid chlorine and bromine if I properly shock and use silver ions. It also sounds like any decent tub will have proper filtration and my efforts to try to find the tub with the very best filtration may be in vain.

[Dr. Spa™ Ret.]

It sounds like I can avoid chlorine and bromine if I properly shock and use silver ions.

So, no chlorine, (something which without, according to the WHO, the population of the Earth would be nearly 80% less), but you're willing to go with potassium monopersulfate.

I don't get it, what's the point?

[AaronSantaCruz]

Oops. I meant no regular chlorine just a weekly chlorine shock. The local Hot Springs dealer tells me that with an ozonator, weekly chlorine shock, and silver ions that the tub should be properly sanitized under normal use. Does that sound correct to you?

[Tman122]

The one part of this that's variable is "normal use" If this means once a week yes you can make that work.

[hottubdan]

Oops. I meant no regular chlorine just a weekly chlorine shock. The local Hot Springs dealer tells me that with an ozonator, weekly chlorine shock, and silver ions that the tub should be properly sanitized under normal use. Does that sound correct to you?

they have 1000's of users on this routine.

[Jacuzzi Jim]

Oops. I meant no regular chlorine just a weekly chlorine shock. The local Hot Springs dealer tells me that with an ozonator, weekly chlorine shock, and silver ions that the tub should be properly sanitized under normal use. Does that sound correct to you?

they have 1000's of users on this routine.

  + 1  And it's not just subject to HS spa's.. 

[chem geek]

The use of silver ions without non-chlorine shock (MPS) does not provide fast disinfection (a table of kill times for chlorine vs. copper vs. silver ions is in this post).  So there is not prevention of person-to-person transmission of disease, particularly viruses.  The EPA-approved use of silver ions is in conjunction with MPS as described in the Nature² Spa Mineral Sanitizer Owner's Manual.

In practice, the risk is low in residential spas, but I just wanted to be clear about using silver ions without a fairly constant residual of MPS.