I am finished looking at hot tubs

[solo]

Solo,
We all know that you see the value in the spas you are considering.  The problem here is that you have decided that your amount of spending is capped off, so it is a complete waste of time for the dealer/salesperson.  When you spend a fair amount of time with a potential customer you tend to build a relationship with them in hopes of earning their business.  Most companies want to earn your business, keep you happy, and hopefully (and with you) a big hopefully you find enjoyment in your spa and refer more people to enter the dealer's showroom.  When a potential customer is UNWILLING to compromise on a sale price because of unreal expectations it does tend to rub a salesperson the wrong way.  Whether it should is a complete different thing.  No it's not personal when a customer doesn't purchase a spa, but, it does leave a bad taste in our mouths.  Companies have to have integrity in what they sell.  If one of the companies meet you price requirements what will happen when you recieve your spa, enjoy it, and start to refer people to that company.  The second thing you will tell your friends (stated loosely) what the price of the spa was that you paid.  Now, if you were to purchase either watkins product for that price, you would have received that steal of the year.  That being said, if one of your referrals happen to come through the doors, they would expect the same price.  Do you see yet how just one customer effects the entire flow for a company?  Each potential customer is worth 10-15 times more than their original purchase.  You're asking a company to potentially loose a considerable amount of revenue.  Just imagine your clients over time reducing your wages,  not real fair is it?  I don't expect you to agree with me because of your narrowed way of thinking.  Close to everyone on this site is very tired of seeing your posts.  Now we are just people posting on a forum and you can piss us off.  We aren't even trying to sell you a spa.  Now imagine the salesperson trying to deal with you.  Can you see why the would be angry at a customer such as yourself?  Good Luck!!!

No, I can't see how a dealer would be angry at a potential customer.  I think it says a lot about the person doing the selling if they do get angry.

When one of my customers calls me to find them an employee, if I don't close the deal, I don't get mad at them.  If I feel like my client has unreasonable expectations, it's always my decision whether or not I work with them.  If they tell me that they want an MLB Superstar but they want to pay minor league wages, I have a decision to make.  Do I show them what they want or do I show them what they say they can afford?  Either way, it's my choice to pursue that deal.  I could always choose not to.  If I show them a superstar that is 30% out of their payrange, I can't be upset when they tell me they can't afford it.   I knew up front what they could pay.  I banked on upselling them and lost.  That was my call and my risk and I have nobody to be upset at but meyself.

So, when I tell a spa dealer that I want a spa with A, B, C, D and E for $7000 (like I told every dealer), when they choose to try to sell me $9000-10,000 tubs, can they really get mad at me for wasting their time?

That's crazy.

[Renee]

We could debate this issue all day if we wanted to.  But nobody is learning anything from these posts, and that's the reason most of us visit this board. And to get some comic relief from persons such as Term!    I'm finding myself going back and reading posts in previous years....I'm getting a lot more useful information from those than wasting my time reading these meaningless posts....

[wedag]

Solo I paid 7700.00 out the door for a HS vanguard. It will be delivered on friday and I will be in spatopa
on sat. You on the other hand will be sitting by the phone just like your waiting for that girl to call.

[Repeat_Offender]

 You on the other hand will be sitting by the phone just like your waiting for that girl to call.

You mean mom? I don't think she has to call on the phone, just yell down in the basement....

[Jacuzzi Jim]

[url]

[East_TX_Spa]

Puss N' Boots could!

[Steve]

We could debate this issue all day if we wanted to.  But nobody is learning anything from these posts, and that's the reason most of us visit this board. And to get some comic relief from persons such as Term!    I'm finding myself going back and reading posts in previous years....I'm getting a lot more useful information from those than wasting my time reading these meaningless posts....

You are so right my dear! There is absolutely NOTHING to learn here other than how to NOT shop for a spa and waste time from a consumer and dealer perspective.

I sold spas for many years and I have had the luxury of NEVER meeting anyone like this shmuck before.

The reality is that there are many posts about "how to shop for a spa" and what to look for when shopping but when the village idiot comes along, it gains far more attention in utter shock and disbelief that someone could be so anal and not understand even the very basics like shopping WITHIN your limit. Unfortunately, the real good information has got lost in the crud spewed by Solo.

My conclusion is that he is either brilliant and has come here for pure entertainment to toy with us, or he's smart like a sack of hammers (my apology to all hammers)...

[D.P. Roberts]

This whole thing reminds me of that scene from "2001". We're like those monkeys looking at that big black obelisk thingy. We can't understand it, so we keep staring at it. Then, we start throwing sticks and rocks at it, but it just sits there, silently, doing nothing.

Eventually, we're all going to go nuts and kill the neighboring monkeys with sticks. And Solo will turn buy a spa, and throw it up into the air, and it will turn into a space station. The end.

[Steve]

This whole thing reminds me of that scene from "2001". We're like those monkeys looking at that big black obelisk thingy. We can't understand it, so we keep staring at it. Then, we start throwing sticks and rocks at it, but it just sits there, silently, doing nothing.

Eventually, we're all going to go nuts and kill the neighboring monkeys with sticks. And Solo will turn buy a spa, and throw it up into the air, and it will turn into a space station. The end.

 :-?

Please don't do drugs boys and girls... This is why...

[solo]

Isn't it obvious that I am here for the shear entertainment value at this point?  I came here wanting to learn about spas and spa pricing.  At that time, I didn't realize it was just a bunch of spa dealers pumping your posts to their local sales offices and a vehicle to push spa sales.  But now I know.  

However, the banter is kind of fun.  It is entertaining for me not only to exhange with others, but also to see how low someone will go to try and pressure you to buy and just how rude a person can be.  And as others have pointed out, there is a nugget of wisdom posted from time to time.

But listen, Steve, Renee, and whomever else doesn't like my stuff, feel free not to read and reply.  When I see that my posts have more responses than anyone elses, I have got to think that many people are enjoying them in some way.  

[ndabunka]

Solo,
We all know that you see the value in the spas you are considering.  The problem here is that you have decided that your amount of spending is capped off, so it is a complete waste of time for the dealer/salesperson.  When you spend a fair amount of time with a potential customer you tend to build a relationship with them in hopes of earning their business.  Most companies want to earn your business, keep you happy, and hopefully (and with you) a big hopefully you find enjoyment in your spa and refer more people to enter the dealer's showroom.  When a potential customer is UNWILLING to compromise on a sale price because of unreal expectations it does tend to rub a salesperson the wrong way.  Whether it should is a complete different thing.  No it's not personal when a customer doesn't purchase a spa, but, it does leave a bad taste in our mouths.  Companies have to have integrity in what they sell.  If one of the companies meet you price requirements what will happen when you recieve your spa, enjoy it, and start to refer people to that company.  The second thing you will tell your friends (stated loosely) what the price of the spa was that you paid.  Now, if you were to purchase either watkins product for that price, you would have received that steal of the year.  That being said, if one of your referrals happen to come through the doors, they would expect the same price.  Do you see yet how just one customer effects the entire flow for a company?  Each potential customer is worth 10-15 times more than their original purchase.  You're asking a company to potentially loose a considerable amount of revenue.  Just imagine your clients over time reducing your wages,  not real fair is it?  I don't expect you to agree with me because of your narrowed way of thinking.  Close to everyone on this site is very tired of seeing your posts.  Now we are just people posting on a forum and you can piss us off.  We aren't even trying to sell you a spa.  Now imagine the salesperson trying to deal with you.  Can you see why the would be angry at a customer such as yourself?  Good Luck!!!

Seahawk - I think your missing the objective here.  Some dealers would be happy to sell a large volume of spas for a reduced/competitive price.  Rec Warehouse is an EXCELLENT example.  They operate MUCH more like the typical "big box" shop in that they hire college kids with about 15 minutes of Spa training and pay them peanuts ($12/hour) and NO commissions.  However, in contrast it appears that 99% of the dealers on here are the smaller "mom and pop" shops with higher integrity, trained sales people who are rewarded with reasonable commissions, etc.

So, there's nothing wrong with seeking a higher volume dealer in order to get a more significant discount.  I recommended that approach to Solo a little over a month ago.  I don't recall if it was a public thread or via PM but I did direct him to ONLY look at higher volume dealers.  I think Rec Warehouse deals in Caldera's and he was considering one of them so I thought that would be a perfect fit.

[ndabunka]

I certainly don't expect dealers to bend over for me, nor would I want them to.  I simply know what I'm willing to pay for something and don't bend from that.  I then let the dealer decide if it is in his best interest to sell me a tub.  I'm not mad at them if they don't.  I trust that they know what will be good business decision for them.  

If I were going to take the "meet half way approach", I would have started my offers with a much lower number.  Rather, I chose not to play that game and made firm cash offers.    I did that with 2 dealers and will probably do so again real soon with a 3rd.  With the next one I might make the offer face to face rather than over the phone.  If they see that I am actually ready to write the check and not going to pick up the phone and shop the price, maybe that will make a difference.  

Over the PHONE?  That will NOT work!  People calling on the phone (for ANY business) are usually just price comparison.  ALL OFFERS MUST BE MADE IN PERSON.  No WONDER your not getting the discounts you are asking for.  Even telling them you will give them CASH means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING over the phone!  Get out there and "do it in person" or don't do it at all!

Also, in order to get the BEST deal you need to use body movements.  When they say it's $8,200 but they'll discount it to $7,600 "just for you" you can tell them face-to-face that you KNOW that other buyers around the country have been able to buy this EXACT same unit for as low as $6,800.  State that you'll write a $500 deposit check (as you are pulling out your checkbook) TODAY but only IF they will meet your BOTTOM LINE target of $6,900.  They will continue to balk but at least you will get a second (lower) offer (probably around $7,400 "just for you").  At that point, make certain that you are also looking at the Hot Springs Vangard and "in your opinion" it is a nicer tub for the $7,400 and if you were going to spend THAT much, you would have simply bought the Hot Springs so in order to win YOUR business with THEIR tub, they need to be more competitive on price and come down to what others around the country are paying.  If they continue to balk, make them one "FINAL" offer of $7,200 and ask for a 2 month time frame for delivery.  This is a diversion tactic and can help distract the dealer by having him focus on something he can probably EASILY meet (like a long 2 month delivery time as it's pretty standard anyway) and will usually lead to the dealer thinking "Maybe I can sell him a floor model for that price" and you may find that you can get the unit off the floor THAT week for near that price.  If you want to be sticky on the color/option, just stick with that $7,200 price and tell him that you will be buying SOMEONE's tub THAT week and that YOU will call him back on the last day of your decision (Usually a Saturday afternoon near the end of the month).  Don't leave it to him to call you trying to win your business.  As you have seen, that approach doesn't work.  Then, you call him back with that EXACT same price of $7,200.  Let him know that you've already come to a "bottom dollar" price on the tub you "really want" from his competitor and would still be 'willing" to buy his tub but ONLY for the lower price you mentioned.  If he says, "Sorry $7,400 is the best I can do".  You need to hang up and buy the other brand and get on with life.  Someone already pointed out in this thread that our own time has a value to it.  Figured by the company I work for that is the cost of salary, benefits, etc.  Figured on commission (like 90% of all headhunters), there is still a value.  This process has already burnt up more than $1,000 in TIME for you (most likely).  Just think, you could be on the Yahoo! BBS's chatting about why AAPL stock was such a good buy when it was selling for $120/share (when you started this thread) now that it is selling for $167.86/share (as of this posting).  If you had invested your $7K in that stock then you would have $9,791.83 today with which to buy any tub you may desire.  In other words, this forum is "interesting" but there are a lot more fun things out there both IRL as well as here on the net.

[Steve]

First off... Bunky... Paragraphs buddy, paragraphs!  

Secondly, don't you find it somewhat odd that you have to spell it out in such a simple way and explain to people that are  "serious" about buying a spa, that they should do it in person? I just find that so very basic and gradeschool that we've never had to do that before on this forum.

Oh and Solo...feel free not to read my posts...

Mommy called...at the end of the month she's going to stop paying for your internet so she said you have to find a job and move out of her basement before your 50th Birthday.
Just remember... you're never really SOLO while you have your Mommy to guide you.

[Vanguard]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[solo]

Hi.

My name is Steve and I used to be a spa dealer.  Then I found the wonderful world of selling humans.  The margins are much higher.  It started innocently.  I replied to an Internet add wanting children for scientiifc experiements.  It was hard parting with my kids, at first.  Then the checks started rolling in. There's been no looking back since that day.

Do you need a mail order bride?  Maybe you're in the market for a live in nanny or some child labor?  I'm your guy.  PM me and we can talk...

Steve "Shortbus" the Human Trader