Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: East_TX_Spa on November 17, 2005, 02:18:25 pm
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For everyone that is considering purchasing or already owns a spa with the entrails exposed, please take heed of this tale of woe. :(
Back in 2001, a robust, courtly gentleman visited my store to peruse my wares. I obviously failed the man, who then had the misfortune of deciding to purchase a spa from a charlatan down the road. He "saved" $800 by doing this but, alas, it was not to be spatopia for him. For you see, he was convinced by an unscrupulous salesperson that he didn't need all that foam clogging up the underside of his spa. If his spa leaked, it could be easily fixed. After all, digging through so much foam would be "a hassle and very expensive." A series of unfortunate events would soon unfold.
Fast forward to 2004. This man (a good man, mind you, with a good heart and a trusting nature) returned to my establishment with a heavy burden and a weary disposition. He related his tale of woe to me with such despondency in his voice that I steeled my resolve to help him in whatever way I could. The story (and the photographic documentation which follows) is not for the faint of heart, so be warned, yet, do not despair, for a happy ending will reward all those who dare to stay the course.
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC00925.jpg)
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC00920.jpg)
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC00921.jpg)
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC00922.jpg)
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC00923.jpg)
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC00924.jpg)
Rodents! Rats, mice, squirrels, the bane of mankind, had taken residency beneath the hollow redwood walls of his pride and joy. For vermin such as these, his spa was a virtual paradise in which to reside during the long, harsh winter months. After all, it was reasonably warm within the dark recesses. To quench their thirst, an abundant supply of clean water flowed above their heads, ripe for the plundering of sharp, wicked teeth. The gnawing-gnawing-gnawing, day and night, was maddening to the man, much as the Tell-Tale Heart in the story of old. Massive spa failure ensued, massive disappointment deluged it's owner.
After the dealership informed our protaganist that "Hey, we just sell spas, we don't service them. We don't even sell that brand any more, but I'll sell you a new one."
"No thank you, I'm going to see Terminator."
I greeted him like the Prodigal Son, welcomed him with open arms, and offered him an exceptional opportunity to own a spa that would meet his expectations. We removed his tumorous box of disappointment and replaced it with a world class product he can be proud of. His life is now fulfilling, as everyone's should be. He has found spatopia!
Terminator
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Interesting Post. Do you think we should be weary of varments living under the spa? Or is this because he did not have it fully foamed and insulated?
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Interesting Post. Do you think we should be weary of varments living under the spa? Or is this because he did not have it fully foamed and insulated?
Your spa will be fine! It is fully insulated, has a solid rock hard bottom, and rodent screens to prevent any access. You'll be good to go.
Terminator
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Your spa will be fine! It is fully insulated, has a solid rock hard bottom, and rodent screens to prevent any access. You'll be good to go (once your spa is running :().
Terminator
Now the heathens, pagens and sodimites have warned me that although I have a FF hot tub, that since my tub's bottom is not sealed, some rodenst will burrow into the foam. I find this hard to belive, as they would have to come through the cement pad. Others have warned me of plauges of ants and locust. ? ? ?
Still, my old tub wasn't ff and I had several happy furry mice living in the shell.
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Heed not, my friend, the hysterics of naysayers. Yea, lest ye fall under the influence of their wickedness, have faith in me, your brethren, when I impart upon you the peace of mind that comes with ownership of your given vessel. Hearken to my words!
Terminator
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Is that insulation typical? There isn't even insualtion on the plumping. There is no insulation on the inside cabinet wall. This cannot be a typical TP tub?
You can tell us, who makes that tub?
looks simiilliar to my first tub that was a P.O.S.
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Doesn't that make YOU the protaganist?
Which then raises the question; Who is the true antagonist? the other spa dealer or the varments?
NOt only are you an innovate chief, you are one heck of a writer.....I really enjoyed your story!
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One of the largest spa companies in the industry. I have removed all vestiges of identification so as not to promote disharmony.
I'd give you the initials, but you killed me in the movie post! ;D
An impartial person will happen along shortly, I'm sure.
Terminator
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When I bought my current house, after the previous owner moved out, there was this huge pile of what looked like sawdust where his hot tub had been...when I looked closer, it seemed to be fine granular spongey material......when I asked about it, it turn out to be the insulation from his tub.....it was a FF tub, and the bottom wasn't sealed.....ants had destroyed the innards, and when the tub was picked up, the insulation and an awful ot of ants were left on the deck.....the colony migrated to under the edge of the paver deck, where I hope I did a successful job of killing the bastages. I'm planning on putting a whole bunch of ant traps and a couple mouse traps in the cabinet of my new tub, (just in case) but since the blower pulls air from within the cabinet, I don't want to be blowing ant dust / rat poison laden air through the water, ya know?
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Doesn't that make YOU the protaganist?
Which then raises the question; Who is the true antagonist? the other spa dealer or the varments?
NOt only are you an innovate chief, you are one heck of a writer.....I really enjoyed your story!
I am simply this, a purveyor of dreams, inconsequential to the story as a whole, essential only as a necessory. ;)
(I'm glad you enjoyed the story Bonibelle. I have too much time on my hands, as if that's not obvious!) :)
Terminator
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I was having a rough time rationalizing the care and feeding of our cats until now!
All rats agree: Nothing chews like a DAIT....... 8)
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Doesn't that make YOU the protaganist?
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/TRsibe2001L.jpg)
This is the TRUE hero of our story. Alas, the last of its breed...... :'(
Terminator
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I have fixed a many of Hot Spring with rodent damage. No spa is rat proof. I have seen many of tunnels through the foam.
Now I still prefer full foam, it is the only way to go, but your post implies full foam spas do not get rodent damage.
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So is there any way to keep critters out? I was going to put my new spa on a brick base but thought better of it knowing how many burrowing things I have running around in my yard. Since we feed the birds and live near farms, we have plenty of rodents in the winter. If the tub is on a deck they shouldn't be able to get under it should they?
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Wow...that is some good writing Term! Very interesting post. I don't have a HS, so now I'm wondering if my brand new Marquis is impervious to all manner of pests/rodents...and what can I do to safeguard my beautiful tub?
Even living in the city we have seen rats run across our fence at night. Should I put out traps and cheese? Tell us oh ye man of wisdom...what can we subserviant people do?
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I have fixed a many of Hot Spring with rodent damage. No spa is rat proof. I have seen many of tunnels through the foam.
Now I still prefer full foam, it is the only way to go, but your post implies full foam spas do not get rodent damage.
No implication, my friend. I have seen it a couple of times myself. But, NEVER to this extent. In the Brand X spa, I've yet to find a single hose that didn't get chewed.
Terminator
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I have a good recipe for rat tacos!
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Tell us oh ye man of wisdom...what can we subserviant people do?
First of all, I am subserviant to you and Bonibelle, not the other way around!
Secondly, your spas will be fine. I'm sure that the founder of your brand of spa (the Marquis d' Sade) had enough foresight to design a rodent-resistant product due to the preponderance of the Bubonic Plague during his lifetime. The bottom is certainly sealed and any crevices properly obstructed to prevent unwanted guests. If there happens to be any openings, a mesh screen should suffice.
Go and be fruitful to one another.
Terminator
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I have a good recipe for rat tacos!
You and Taco Bell, both!
Terminator
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Very good post/information Term!!!
I too made the same mistake,and purchased what seemed to be a bargain of a spa,prior to being infomed.
I paid 2600 for a piece of junk brand new built spa,and sold/replaced it within 3 months,with a Caldera. Very happy with my purchase,and learned my lesson the hard way.
BTW,don't you texans use c4 charges to get rid of pests/rodents in your spas? grin
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Very good post/information Term!!!
BTW,don't you texans use c4 charges to get rid of pests/rodents in your spas? grin
Well thank you, nice hairy lady! I appreciate it!
As far as pest control, we use the c4 on liberals and lawyers. .223 hollowpoints work nicely on smaller, less bothersome critters.
Terminator
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No implication, my friend. I have seen it a couple of times myself. But, NEVER to this extent. In the Brand X spa, I've yet to find a single hose that didn't get chewed.
Terminator
I agree that is the worst one I have seen, and if it was fully foamed it would not have been as bad.
I guess even the rats are bigger in Texas.
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I guess even the rats are bigger in Texas.
Yep, we call them Demo-rats!
Terminator
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Term,
I'd pick up a few rubber rats at the holloween store and place them inside that tub's cabinet for added effect. ;D
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Term,
I'd pick up a few rubber rats at the holloween store and place them inside that tub's cabinet for added effect. ;D
That's not a bad idea drewstar. I actually have that spa on the deck sitting next to this:
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC00928.jpg)
(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/DSC00926.jpg)
HotSpring Personal (Jetsetter) Spa built in April 1985, 1 month before I graduated high school. Runs like it was brand new.
This is a great sales tool for me to show the differences between what I sell and what my competitors sell. Seeing is believing. :)
Terminator
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Get something like this to put in the cabinet.
(http://rickscafe.diaryland.com/images/rat.jpg)
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;D ;D ;D
Terminator
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He looks like my neighbor with the dog!
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(http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b206/EastTexasSpa/TRsibe2001L.jpg)
This is the TRUE hero of our story. Alas, the last of its breed...... :'(
Terminator
Ahhh...... The beloved Siberian, My favorite from back in my HS days.
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Is that insulation typical? There isn't even insualtion on the plumping. There is no insulation on the inside cabinet wall. This cannot be a typical TP tub?
Way more typical than you would believe. I'm a FF guy , but if you are considering a TP tub make them remove a SIDE panel. If the foam isn't covering the plumbing and/or applied to the inside cabinet wall, well.........
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Anyone who owns a spa in a cool climate should consider putting mouse repellent or poison in the equipment compartment. Mice (not familiar with rats) love the warm environment and are very crafty at getting into these spaces. Anyone who thinks their spa is immune from this is in denial. A little prevention is well worth it, IMO.
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Thanks Tony, I figured that mice would somehow figure out how to squeeze into the cabinet when it gets cold out. What exactly is mouse repellent? I am not real big on putting poisons out because other critters can become unintended victims. If there is a friendly way to keep them out I would like to try it. :)
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My boss had some big ol' rats in his attic and he got an electric rat trap. It's like a big bug zapper but it killled those rats dead!
Terminator
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Thanks Tony, I figured that mice would somehow figure out how to squeeze into the cabinet when it gets cold out. What exactly is mouse repellent? I am not real big on putting poisons out because other critters can become unintended victims. If there is a friendly way to keep them out I would like to try it. :)
Mothballs, but then when you open your venturi air injectors, the scent may repell you from the tub....
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Ok, you know somebody that has a rat zapper? Since we are on the topic of pests....Tell me what to do about my neighbor's dog that keeps peeing on... my deck, my flowers, my pool, my swing, my cooler full of cheap beer...Seriously I don't know what my husband will do it that PIA dog pees on our new hot tub! I have tried everything to get rid of him but.... no luck. ???Think the rat zapper would work? Tell me details...and tell the truth are you really typing or using voice recognition software?
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Bonibelle, I am typing as sure as the sune rises somewhere.
My Grandpa had a neighbor with a mean old German Shepherd that kept getting in Grandma's flower bed. He strung up an electrical wire across there one day.
Well, old Dusty (the dog) come sidling up to the flower bed one day, took a sniff of the wire, and commenced to peeing on it. ZZZZAAAAAAPPPPPP!!!!!!! Rur-rurr -rrrurrr-yeelppp-yeellllp! He took off and never came back! The electricity travelled all the way upstream and zapped him right in his ding-a-ling!
That might do the trick!
Terminator
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Well, old Dusty (the dog) come sidling up to the flower bed one day, tookd a sniff of the wire, and commenced to peeing on it. ZZZZAAAAAAPPPPPP!!!!!!! Rur-rurr -rrrurrr= yeelppp-yeellllp!
Terminaor
I thought only drunk high school boys did that.
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I may be borrowing your gun!
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I thought only drunk high school boys did that.
Only once. I speak from experience.
Terminator
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I may be borrowing your gun!
Borrow! Heck, I'll give you one if you want. It'll free up space to buy another! ;D
Terminator
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ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Terminator,
are you telling us that Hot springs spas won't get vermin and rodents in them,
Oh PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEE tell me this I am a proud owner of a tiger river sumatran bought in august. I am really enjoying and your answer will make me very happy if its a good answer
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ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Terminator,
are you telling us that Hot springs spas won't get vermin and rodents in them,
Oh PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEE tell me this I am a proud owner of a tiger river sumatran bought in august. I am really enjoying and your answer will make me very happy if its a good answer
Verily, I say unto you, it shall be easier for a donkey to pass through the eye of the beholder than for a critter to enter the inner sanctum of your spa's family jewels.
The bottom of the spa is sealed with a 60 lb layer of high-density foam insulation, hard as a rock. All access points are protected with a mesh metal screen to prevent access by all vermin personnel. As long as the spa is on a level, flat surface, you are good to go!
Terminator
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And I have been thinking about that chewed up spa. I am guessing that the varments took up residence looking for shelter but at some point the owner must have just turned it off and left it for a while. With all those chewed hoses, the rats would have been flooded out...wouldn't they? I guess I am saying that a lot of the damage could have happened because no one was using the tub or even noticed the insides were being destroyed. So as long as you check regularly for rodent damage, you should be OK?????
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And I have been thinking about that chewed up spa. I am guessing that the varments took up residence looking for shelter but at some point the owner must have just turned it off and left it for a while. With all those chewed hoses, the rats would have been flooded out...wouldn't they? I guess I am saying that a lot of the damage could have happened because no one was using the tub or even noticed the insides were being destroyed. So as long as you check regularly for rodent damage, you should be OK?????
I'm sorry that I have upset some of you. Bonibelle, Lablover2004, my precious cappykat, you are all going to be just fine. You have all purchased top-of-the-line spas that are as rodent-proof as a spa can be. Bonibelle is correct in the respect of being dilligent in your observations of your particular spas. Open the equipment door from time to time to make sure there are no signs of infestation. Those little boogers can get in the darndest of places. Due dilligence will prevent any such infestation.
Rest easy, my dears.
Terminator
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Last year we had the wiring harness of our truck chewed up by chipmunks (2500.00 worth of damage and by the way, the comprehensive portion of car insurance covers it)
Our mechanic told us to stuff bounce sheets in every crevice possible to repel them. (NOT the fragrance free ones) We haven't had any problems since, but then this was the first time it's ever happened. I put bounce sheets in my tub cabinet now too. Since then, I've talked to people who have heard of Bounce working as repellant, so it's not just my mechanics idea. Just be sure to change them every couple months or so- I change them whenever I drain and fill-which will be tomorrow.
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I thought only drunk high school boys did that.
Anyone else ever watch Ren & Stimpy? "Don't wiz on the electric fence"
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Bounce sounds great..it repells my kids, they swear if I dry their clothes using Bounce, they won't wear them.
;D
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I have fixed a many of Hot Spring with rodent damage. No spa is rat proof. I have seen many of tunnels through the foam.
Now I still prefer full foam, it is the only way to go, but your post implies full foam spas do not get rodent damage.
Amen brother! No spa is rodent proof. I have seen rodents chew through the sides of panels to get in. Any little crevice will allow them the opportunity to exploit it, and chew an area big enough to get through. Stay vigilante and beware of rodents!
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Stay vigilante and beware of rodents!
Just to try and reassure some of you that are worried about varmints getting in the spa, just try to make sure you seal any crevices where they might squeeze through. It doesn't take a very big opening for them. Open the equipment door from time to time and look for signs of infestation: droppings, gnaw marks, tiny little beer cans, piles of insulation or grass. Do this and most of you will be alright.
Terminator
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What exactly is mouse repellent? I am not real big on putting poisons out because other critters can become unintended victims. If there is a friendly way to keep them out I would like to try it. :)
There is a mouse repellent Doc sells at his site that is a mixture of herbs in a cloth bag that seems to work. I have also kept moth balls, but correct, the odor will seep up. Right now I use the dryer sheets. That also seems to work.
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Just to try and reassure some of you that are worried about varmints getting in the spa, just try to make sure you seal any crevices where they might squeeze through. It doesn't take a very big opening for them. Open the equipment door from time to time and look for signs of infestation: droppings, gnaw marks, tiny little beer cans, piles of insulation or grass. Do this and most of you will be alright.
Terminator
Exactly. Be cogniscent of what is happening with your spa and a little preventitive measures and there will be no problems.
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http://www.ratmousezapper.com/
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Way back, when I was in th USAF - one of our radar systems shut down. So out we go to the site. Once in side we knew something had fried. It was real, real nasty smelling. All we ever found was about 2 inches of a rats tail (we think it was a rat) and some ashes. It somehow got into the high voltage section of the transmitter and shorted itself across a capacitor. The rat ,or whatever it was, basically vaporized. POOF!!!
I'm guessing it didn't feel a thing.
r100rs
Then there is the time I found a mouse inside of a customers copy machine. We won't go into details on that one. Just say it was worse the the radar one.
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At my previous job, at the warehouse, I was having trouble with my computer, so the service tech came out and found a live mouse had set up a one bedroom loft in the tower!!!
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Ever since I saw those pics I told my husband "take care of it"!! I'm having bad dreams about it...HA!!
I remember seeing the underneath of the HotSprings...you know I never asked about it when we were looking at the Marquis? Hey, Mendo...does Maquis have the same protection?
We will have mesh over every conceivable crevice before the week ends!! Thanks my precious Term for the eye opening pictures!!
Everyone have a great Thanksgiving!
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I would just like to clarify the point of this post a bit, if ya'll will indulge me.
The spa I posted to begin this thread is not representative of a quality, well-insulated Thermal Pane spa. It is a cheap, generic, "kit" spa that is prevalent in this and other parts of the country. No preventative measures were taken to secure the spa from infestation and the overall poor design made it conducive to suffering these types of problems.
There are many top-of-the-line spas that use Thermal Pane insulation the proper way, with tight tolerances, abundant insulation, and quality materials. Those of you that own Coleman, Arctics, and any of the other upper-tier TP spas can rest easy knowing that your spa is as rodent-proof as virtually any other spa on the market. EVERYONE remain dilligent towards your spa's care and you will enjoy it critter-free for as long as you own it.
Terminator
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That's what is great about this forum. Things get brought to our attention that might otherwise get overlooked. I appreciate the post!!