Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: jamiho on January 02, 2018, 08:14:24 pm
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So I just bought a reconditioned Marquis Destiny that came with all new components. Had a certified electrician do the electrical work. One and a half weeks after installation, it turned off. After turning it back on, it no longer heats. I called the dealer and they seemed amazed as it had new components. They asked if anything unusual had happened. I told them the day before it shut off and then stopped heating, there were a couple of brief power outages in the area, electricity going off and back on quickly about three times in a row. But that didn't shut down the tub, the shut down and problem occurred the next day. They said if the power surge fried the control board, it wouldn't be covered under warranty because that's out of their control.
Is it possible for a power surge to fry a control board? Or could the electrician have done something wrong?
Sigh. My friends warned me not ot get a hot tub. We had a nice 8 days...
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Oh, I should mention the power surge was in the whole neighborhood, not just our house.
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Yes definitely possible Just had the same happen to a customer of mine with aMarquis Tub
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So I just bought a reconditioned Marquis Destiny that came with all new components. Had a certified electrician do the electrical work. One and a half weeks after installation, it turned off. After turning it back on, it no longer heats. I called the dealer and they seemed amazed as it had new components. They asked if anything unusual had happened. I told them the day before it shut off and then stopped heating, there were a couple of brief power outages in the area, electricity going off and back on quickly about three times in a row. But that didn't shut down the tub, the shut down and problem occurred the next day. They said if the power surge fried the control board, it wouldn't be covered under warranty because that's out of their control.
Is it possible for a power surge to fry a control board? Or could the electrician have done something wrong?
Sigh. My friends warned me not ot get a hot tub. We had a nice 8 days...
Likely one of the biggest causes for fried components.
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So; is this a good argument for putting a surge arresting component on the circuit for the hot tub?
Jack
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I am amazed about this issue and that it didn't come up at all in my hot tub shopping or electrical work.
Not sure the feeling about these surge protector devices but we have one on order, just wish we had know about this issue sooner: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00I506Z3S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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The reason that I asked about it is that they are routinely installed to protect well pumps where I have a house in the mountains in North Carolina. Pumps in my neighborhood are routinely set 800' or more below the ground level, and are correspondingly very expensive to replace. We will be starting our search for a hot tub for the mountain house in about a month; but I will be installing a surge protector first.
Jack
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Depending on the cost of the repair vs the deductible on your home owners insurance policy this might be claim worthy. Just a thought.
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I am amazed about this issue and that it didn't come up at all in my hot tub shopping or electrical work.
Not sure the feeling about these surge protector devices but we have one on order, just wish we had know about this issue sooner: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00I506Z3S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
How do you plan to install this? Will you try to somehow install it inside your cabinet, isolated from the heater? This thing would go up in smoke pretty quickly if wired to your 50A main feed for the tub.
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It is wired into the panel or subpanel that feeds the spa. It is not mounted in the hot tub itself. It will not go up in smoke unless there is a surge; whereupon it becomes sacrificial to the equipment downstream from the surge arrestor. There are whole house surge protectors that are effectively wired to your 200 amp breaker. Not a guarantee of survival; but a precaution to help prevent a potential catastrophic failure.
Jack
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I am amazed about this issue and that it didn't come up at all in my hot tub shopping or electrical work.
Not sure the feeling about these surge protector devices but we have one on order, just wish we had know about this issue sooner: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00I506Z3S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Most likely didn’t come up because I see one every few years and it usually takes out a lot more then just the tub. Usually everything in the house is fried
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It is wired into the panel or subpanel that feeds the spa. It is not mounted in the hot tub itself. It will not go up in smoke unless there is a surge; whereupon it becomes sacrificial to the equipment downstream from the surge arrestor. There are whole house surge protectors that are effectively wired to your 200 amp breaker. Not a guarantee of survival; but a precaution to help prevent a potential catastrophic failure.
Jack
The suppressor linked above has 10 gauge leads. There is a comment on the link regarding 20A loads. I find it hard to believe that thing isn't going to have a melt down on a 50A circuit? Though I couldn't directly find the load rating. I'm only assuming.
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Most likely didn’t come up because I see one every few years and it usually takes out a lot more then just the tub. Usually everything in the house is fried
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Yeah, that's the thing. Everything is working fine on the hot tub except it doesn't heat anymore, everything else in the house is fine.
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Most likely didn’t come up because I see one every few years and it usually takes out a lot more then just the tub. Usually everything in the house is fried
Yeah, that's the thing. Everything is working fine on the hot tub except it doesn't heat anymore, everything else in the house is fine.
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Could be something unrelated. All the sensors good? Has the heater been tested?
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very rare but it does happen, I don't think you can look to the electrician since the spa worked properly for 8 days? before this happened. And unfortunately acts of god are not covered by the manufacturer or the dealer, maybe they'll work with you on a special price in this scenario? I would ask
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I would question the non-warranty claim. For them to deny warranty based on an assumption that the cause of the failure is the power surge. Assuming new parts, you have a manufacturer's warranty, not dealer.
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So I just bought Quick Extender Pro (https://www.villagevoice.com/2021/09/16/quick-extender-pro-review/) and a reconditioned Marquis Destiny that came with all new components. Had a certified electrician do the electrical work. One and a half weeks after installation, it turned off. After turning it back on, it no longer heats. I called the dealer and they seemed amazed as it had new components. They asked if anything unusual had happened. I told them the day before it shut off and then stopped heating, there were a couple of brief power outages in the area, electricity going off and back on quickly about three times in a row. But that didn't shut down the tub, the shut down and problem occurred the next day. They said if the power surge fried the control board, it wouldn't be covered under warranty because that's out of their control.
Is it possible for a power surge to fry a control board? Or could the electrician have done something wrong?
Sigh. My friends warned me not ot get a hot tub. We had a nice 8 days...
Your mistake was mentioning the power outages. All you say in these kinds of situations is that it stopped working out of the blue and you have no idea why.
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Have the dealer submit it under warranty, not mention the power surge, and if it gets denied, THEN they can bill you. That seems fair. Electronic parts go bad all the time.
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It took a while for this to play out, so I'm just responding now.
- Our tub was delivered on 12/20, and hooked up on 12/21 by the electrician that did the wiring a couple weeks prior. It worked fine for 9 days.
- We had a little power disruption on 12/29
- The tub shut off on 12/30 and then stopped heating
- Our final electrical inspection was scheduled for 1/5, and the hot tub dealer would not send out a repair person until that was done
- We did not pass inspection because a #10 ground wire was installed and the Marquis manual specifies #8
- On 1/8 the electrician came back out and switched the #10 ground wire to a #8. On 1/9 we passed final inspection by the city.
- On 1/10 the repair man came out. He found the connection point to the heater on the board was fried, but everything else was fine. He said sometimes the boards just fail due to defects and it was hard to say what caused it. He said he would have to ask the owner of their company about warranty coverage. My husband told him about needing to switch out the ground wire, which was maybe a mistake.
- On 1/11 the owner of the hot tub deal said the warranty wouldn't cover it because the problem occurred while it was operating under unpermitted electrical. They are giving us the part at cost, and not charging for labor.
I suppose that's fair. But it's impossible to say if the problem was due to a surge or not, and there is no way the problem was because w had a #10 ground wire instead of a #8.
Just maybe a lesson for prospective other new hot tub owners. You may not want to operate the tub until your electrical passes final inspection, and you may want to look into a surge protective device.
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I am not an electrician, but very hard to believe the #10 wire made any difference!
Nice dealer by the way ::)
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I was expecting a 'sad story' as I was reading your wrap-up post. I'd say the dealer treated you pretty well all things considered.
Most hot tubs as I understand it are pretty rigorously tested before they leave the factory and certified that everything works just fine, because any snafu that comes up afterwards, are pointed back to the mfgrs. so they do a good job covering their back ends. But then there are a bunch of gray areas like cracks, leaks, and electrical issues just like yours. The dealer really did the right thing by not certifying the tub until after the electrical inspection. Kudos to them for catching the ground issue. Unless you ran all the pumps and features (high electrical load) for an extended period, it's unlikely the smaller ground was the culprit ...it probably was the surge. When power goes back on like that it can send high power down the line and knock out TVs, radios and all sorts of other electronics (motors are usually more tolerant but maybe not the starters).
Anyway, glad you got it resolved w/o a lot of cash outlay! Enjoy.
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One clarification- this is a reconditioned tub purchased from a company that does only used tubs that they fix up. They told me it had all new components installed by them. Their warranty is for one year, but has a lot of exclusions including "acts of nature" and problems occurring under "unpermitted electrical." I don't think the original manufacturer warranty applies anymore, though any warranty on the board to them could apply?
I really don't believe the problem was the ground wire. It could have been the power surge I suppose, but here is no way to know for sure.
I'm not pleased with the result, but I do appreciate they are at least doing it at cost.
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Your mistake was mentioning the power outages. All you say in these kinds of situations is that it stopped working out of the blue and you have no idea why.
I think they would have figured it out anyway. When I first called about the problem they said "It looks like you haven't had your final inspection yet" meaning I think they have access to the City's electrical permit website.
But yeah, for the future, offer as little info as possible.