Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: bimmerdog on February 24, 2013, 06:35:42 pm
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A friend was over and we were using the hot tub. He asked how many person hot tub I had. I have the Sundance Optima and the manufacture says it is a 6-7 person hot tub. So it made me think. What do hot tub manufactures consider a seat is in the tub? Mine is what I consider to be a 6 person tub. Each person has a seat with a jet. The 7Th spot is the cool down seat. In my eyes if the seat does not have any jets above the bottom of the seat then it should not be considered a seat.
It seams to me the more people a manufacture says the tub will hold the more expensive the tub is. If one of your seats is a cool down seat that should not be consider for the number of people in the tub. I understand that even sitting on a cool down seat you are still in the tub but you could then say a tub with a large cool down seat you could get a few more in the tub.
Instead of saying 6-7 seating. It should say seating for 6 room for 7. I have only looked at four of the top manufactures and they all do this with the seating with some of their tubs.
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By all means, start your own manufacturing company, do you own marketing and sales, and see where it gets you.
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A friend was over and we were using the hot tub. He asked how many person hot tub I had. I have the Sundance Optima and the manufacture says it is a 6-7 person hot tub. So it made me think. What do hot tub manufactures consider a seat is in the tub? Mine is what I consider to be a 6 person tub. Each person has a seat with a jet. The 7Th spot is the cool down seat. In my eyes if the seat does not have any jets above the bottom of the seat then it should not be considered a seat.
It seams to me the more people a manufacture says the tub will hold the more expensive the tub is. If one of your seats is a cool down seat that should not be consider for the number of people in the tub. I understand that even sitting on a cool down seat you are still in the tub but you could then say a tub with a large cool down seat you could get a few more in the tub.
Instead of saying 6-7 seating. It should say seating for 6 room for 7. I have only looked at four of the top manufactures and they all do this with the seating with some of their tubs.
What's the difference?
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Whats the difference... To me it is miss marketing. Look at the Hot Springs Aria ( don't jump all over me for this one it is just so easy to see) It say 5 person. Where does the fifth person sit? Let me help you, a cool down seat. Half their body out in the cold. This is not a seat in a five person tub. If it was all the tubs would have a cool down seat and they don't
The reason the Hot tub companies do this is simple. More people more money. Why do you think people that have no idea about hot tubs buy so many cheap tubs that say "look at us we have 120 jets" It is the same principle.
And Dr Spa great answer. I must have done something right with my marketing in my business because I retired when I was 46.
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For years we've all told people here this exact story when they are asking for shopping advice because hot tub literature always exaggerates a bit. Typically you can just subtract 1 from whatever is claimed to get the more realistic "usable" number. They ALL also claim great energy efficiency though most of us know that varies tremendously from maker to maker. They also all show pictures of tubs on their websites/brochures and you never see a cover because the spa always looks better that way in the pictures. Ya gotta love Marketing decisions for consumer goods but its pretty much the same no matter the product or brand for the most part. Its kind of llike when I'm shopping for a car and roll my eyes at the stated MPG. Maybe spa companies should set one their spas up at a frat at a college and however many people get in it at once they could claim that number lol, we'd have 7' square spas that claim to hold 15.
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I fully understand what you mean and with all the other factors of buying a hot tub its just one more and you really need to think how it applies to you. I just got rid of a hot tub that was a 7 person tub. I always said it could seat 5 comfortably. But a family with 2 adults and 5 kids may not have a problem calling it a 7 person tub.
My new tub, and I'd have to go back to Sundance's web site, but I believe its called a 5 person tub and again, technically it can hold 5 people. I think it holds 3 people comfortably. 4 people, well, define comfort. Me and 4 naked super models real comfortable. I do have a friend who is a starting NFL offensive linemen. Me, him and 3 of his buddies, not so comfortable. But I had a real good feel for what I was buying before I put my money down, so this is just another marketing issue to be aware of.
A lot of people made a big deal about Subway's foot long not being 12", when in my opinion they should have gone after them for the pictures of their subs in their ads. I swear in their ads each sub has 3 pounds of meat on it. Now that is a big lie. With the hot tub, you can call it a 7 person tub, I can see the photos and all the specs, unless your ordering online without ever seeing it in person.
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Whats the difference... To me it is miss marketing. Look at the Hot Springs Aria ( don't jump all over me for this one it is just so easy to see) It say 5 person. Where does the fifth person sit? Let me help you, a cool down seat. Half their body out in the cold. This is not a seat in a five person tub. If it was all the tubs would have a cool down seat and they don't
The reason the Hot tub companies do this is simple. More people more money. Why do you think people that have no idea about hot tubs buy so many cheap tubs that say "look at us we have 120 jets" It is the same principle.
And Dr Spa great answer. I must have done something right with my marketing in my business because I retired when I was 46.
For someone who claims to enjoy hottubbing, you certainly seem to have a lot of pent up hostility towards the hot tub industry, and again it seems like you are trying to stir shit up for no good reason. Maybe retiring early left you with too much free time? Just a joke buddy, hope it comes across as such.
Personally I don't have a problem with the labeling. If a tub claims to have 120 jets, I'm sure it has 120 jets and I have no problem. If they claim their 120 jets makes the tub better than another tub with fewer jets, then I have a problem with their marketing. Similar to the seating question. Your own post states HotSprings' tub (dude, get over hotsprings already) has 5 locations where people can sit. I think that qualifies as a 5-seater. And as long as all tub manufacturers follow that logic, then I'm fine with that. It makes apples to apples comparisons straightforward. No harm, no foul. Now, if they start including the places around the edge of the tub where people could theoretically sit and dangle their feet in the water, I would take issue with it.
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(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-IouL5flz608/T6ujnUGcoAI/AAAAAAAADmQ/XxdHbcBE_jY/s1600/Hot_Tub7.jpg)
(http://captainchang.com/images/photos/cr-hot-tub-crowd.jpg)
(http://www.ssqq.com/travel/images/handsomehottub01.jpg)
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Thats a 15 seater.
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Hey Dr. Spa fantastic pictures. Love it. It also proves my point. Where do we draw the line on what a company can say about their product.
I have no pent up hostility against any tub company. I just like to make people stop being sheep's and just follow what a company tells them when you can see it is not fully true. I see something that is wrong and I state it. If I can change it I will. If I can't change it then I put it out there for others to talk about it and maybe down the road it may be changed. As long as consumers just let ANY company put out any info they want and never get questioned then we as consumers are just SHEEP.
Having post like this may help newbies looking at a tub that never thought about the seating. Really guys it's not a bad thing to have "intelligent" conversations on subject that may help others.
I do have a lot of free time because the damn snow won't melt so no golf yet.
To all that think I have some thing against Hot Spring....I don't. It was the tub I was buying. The wife didn't like it not me. I used the Aria to back up what I was saying because it shows how hot tub companies push the seating as far as they can. Cool down seat should not be able to be used as a HOT TUB SEATING. If you think it should be then why not call the Aria a 6 person tub? Look how big the cool down seat is.
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I think a valid question would be: Which manufacturers are honest about their seating?
I have a Maax which seems to follow most manufacturers.
It says 6-7 adults.
It has 6 jetted seats and what could be considered a cool down unjetted flat surface.
It can hold maybe 2-3 adults very comfortably, 4 adults without arms touching. 5+ and you will be touching your neighbor.
6-7 adults would be using alcohol as a lubricant, or maybe if the owner was a swinger.
I also purchased a Bradford years back for my father's house.
It says 4-6 adults.
It is a flat bench design and will sit 4 adults very comfortably and 6 adults without arms touching.
It's been 8 plus adults many times with a little alcohol lubrication.
One thing that is nice about both tubs is that people can sit around the perimeter with just their legs in. Maybe the hot tub companies should start advertising adults + legs to out-spec their competition ;D
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The last photo is a cruise ship hot tub, an area I have some expertise ;) On 2/9 Carnival's Freedom was a clothing optional cruise. There would have been some interesting hot tub pics there.
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Boy, you sure hope those crowded spas have the right chemical balance or lean heavy on the sanitizer side.
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"It can hold maybe 2-3 adults very comfortably, 4 adults without arms touching. 5+ and you will be touching your neighbor.
6-7 adults would be using alcohol as a lubricant, or maybe if the owner was a swinger."
rin-spa-aic this might be the funnest thing I have ever read on this forum. Well done :)
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The last photo is a cruise ship hot tub, an area I have some expertise ;) On 2/9 Carnival's Freedom was a clothing optional cruise. There would have been some interesting hot tub pics there.
I heard they canceled the cougar cruse.....
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I've always compared hot tubs to tents....when they say "sleeps 4"...means 2 nice and comfortably....the Max number is always just that....you can get them in but you wouldn't want to do it on a regular basis....
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The last photo is a cruise ship hot tub, an area I have some expertise ;) On 2/9 Carnival's Freedom was a clothing optional cruise. There would have been some interesting hot tub pics there.
I heard they canceled the cougar cruse.....
At the risk of alienating someone, I heard it was the Bear Cruise.
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I have to admit, I didn't have time to read each post fully, but skimmed through, so this point may have already been made. Another issue is water displacement.
Mine is advertised as 4-5 people, it is a 6' dia. Bullfrog 151R. I've had 4 people in comfortably and there is a spot between some jets that can act as a seat that gets some water action from adjacent jets, it's one of my favorite locations actually, yet if 5 larger people used it at once, the water level would have to start off below the fill line to stay in the tub. After having 4 average size adults in the tub one night starting with the water at the fill line, I had to add water the next day to make up for splash out.
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I have to admit, I didn't have time to read each post fully, but skimmed through, so this point may have already been made. Another issue is water displacement.
Mine is advertised as 4-5 people, it is a 6' dia. Bullfrog 151R. I've had 4 people in comfortably and there is a spot between some jets that can act as a seat that gets some water action from adjacent jets, it's one of my favorite locations actually, yet if 5 larger people used it at once, the water level would have to start off below the fill line to stay in the tub. After having 4 average size adults in the tub one night starting with the water at the fill line, I had to add water the next day to make up for splash out.
Great post. Didn't even think about that part of the whole equation.