Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: neilpeart on March 31, 2011, 08:29:35 pm
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I know that it is better to purchase a name brand tub and to purchase it locally when at all possible. Where I live, my options are quite limited so lets assume the only way I can get a tub is to purchase it online. In the last few days, I have looked at dozens of online spa sites. Does anyone know what the most credible and reliable online hot tub sites are along with the best tubs that are sold at these sites?
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I know that it is better to purchase a name brand tub and to purchase it locally when at all possible. Where I live, my options are quite limited so lets assume the only way I can get a tub is to purchase it online. In the last few days, I have looked at dozens of online spa sites. Does anyone know what the most credible and reliable online hot tub sites are along with the best tubs that are sold at these sites?
If on-line were my option for a new spa I'd probably buy used.
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I don't have that option either.
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I second the used idea, rather than questionable on-line vendors. Try craigslist, e-bay and classified.
I would also try the dealer locators that most big manufacturers have... to see if they can direct you to a respectable dealer.
If you share your location and situation here, some of the dealers here may have ideas that could help.
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You guys are not answering my question. Think of it as a hypothetical.
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Lol, they are answering you..they don't have a positive opinion of any on-line spa sales site. It would essentially be buy at your own risk. If you don't have a local dealer, who would service your spa? There is a lot more to owning a spa than just the purchase..You need to look down the road because inevitably you will need some sort of service, some support. Additionally, if you search this site you will find at the top of the list for purchasing a spa...wet testing. Buying on line, you will have no idea if the tub is the right fit for you or if you even like it. So it's like a crap shoot..but a rather expensive one ;)
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You guys are not answering my question. Think of it as a hypothetical.
If you're really that remote to where there is no dealer available I still would not buy from an on-line spa site (faith based purchase and I don't have faith in them) BUT this is the rare case where maybe buying a Costco spa on-line is for you. It won't be a great spa and you won't have a dealer there to help you (which you obviously wouldn't with any of the random on-line guys) but it won't break the bank and at least it will be from Costco and they'll let you return it if needed.
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I understand what you guys are saying. Still, for all of its downfalls, I cannot believe that all online sites are equal. Every type of business has vendors,installers and suppliers that vary in terms of customer service, honesty and method of operation. All I wanted to know was, if in the event I made the decision to purchase online, which of those tub suppliers gives me the best chance for satisfaction as opposed to the ones that I absolutely need to stay away from. Everything else you are saying is completely understood and taken into consideration. Thanks.
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I don't think those of us on the forum know any more about the on-line tub vendors than you do, based on your recent investigation. It would be interesting to hear the results of your research and which ones you conclude will be "most credible and reliable online hot tub sites are along with the best tubs" and best "in terms of customer service, honesty and method of operation".
You may be providng valuable information to those who visit this site in the future who also live in such remote areas that there are no reputable spa dealers within a reasonable vicinity. It will be important to follow up on your experience over time to confirm whether the tub and on-line seller (if still in business) lived up to your expectations.
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Well, I'm still trying to find a dealer that meets my needs. I've started contacting dealers in Charlotte, NC, roughly 70 miles from my home. Problem is, they don't respond when I ask them what they have in stock and what the prices are. Its like they want me to come down and see for myself. I already spent a day last week in Greensboro checking inventories and with gas costs being what they are, I'm not going anywhere else without knowing specifics. My initial thoughts on the hot tub industry is that it is not very user friendly. Local Craigslist has nothing but brand new Laguna spas with the exception of the used Caldera spa we looked at yesterday.
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I understand what you guys are saying. Still, for all of its downfalls, I cannot believe that all online sites are equal.
I don't think they all are equal either. I also know that you won't know which can be trusted. You don't want to rely on how well the website is constructed, that means nothing toward the quality of the product.
Its a TOTAL crapshoot, that’s the point. I also know I’ve seen many people who buy this way and come here to talk about the issues they have after they discover that warranty that read well isn't worth the paper they print it out onto. You can’t drive down to their store and complain when issues arise. It’s the fringe players who have opened up websites to sell spas, not the mainstream spa makers whose products have proven themselves in the field.
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Well, I'm still trying to find a dealer that meets my needs. I've started contacting dealers in Charlotte, NC, roughly 70 miles from my home. Problem is, they don't respond when I ask them what they have in stock and what the prices are. Its like they want me to come down and see for myself. I already spent a day last week in Greensboro checking inventories and with gas costs being what they are, I'm not going anywhere else without knowing specifics. My initial thoughts on the hot tub industry is that it is not very user friendly. Local Craigslist has nothing but brand new Laguna spas with the exception of the used Caldera spa we looked at yesterday.
Its common for dealers to want you to come in and not want to try to make a deal over the phone. That doesn't mean they're not user friendly, it just means the world doesn't always go by your rules.
Heck, 70 miles isn't that major of a haul; I assumed you were even farther away than that. This is a big purchase; you need to spend the gas and time on a Saturday. Put your stubbornness aside and make the trek or just close your eyes, cross your fingers and buy on-line. Its really that simple.
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Nobody is going to suggest Haven? Just kidding, I don't have anything of real value to add to this conversation ;D
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just as everyone else here has stated we are not fans of online spa purchases, yes you say all business have vendors, installers and suppliers, That may be true in different product catergories, Spas not the same, Most of the on line guys sell you a spa it shows up on your driveway, then you have to find a way to get it to were its going.. as for service most local spa dealers do not do service for the online companies, If this was a case that they sell the spa, they have someone local install and take care of it, what use would a (local) company being supoorted by local consumers,, most dealers will not deal with the online, that is what seperates local dealers for support and online companies, Also i don't know of any high end brands( name brands selling spas on the internet and selling acroos the U.S, Most high end brands require that dealer to be able to service the product. So say they are located in Florida and sell the spa into Washington how can they service it. The local guy who carries that brand is not obligated to repair it... He did not sell it.... But for only being 70 miles away not a big deal, Were we are located i have a lot of farm land around i have many customers that are 150 miles away,,,, But the question i have is if you are wooried about the cost of gas why are you buying a hot tub. I am not busting on you. But that does not make sense. Tubs are a luxury item, Yes they are great for therapy but when the economy tanked the first things to stop being purchased (hot tubs)...You might be surprised to go and see how they work with you better in the store than on the floor. I think that most dealers will be gun shy on the phone( like what they have and the prices. alot of dealers will shop the competition on the phone,,,we see that happen to us .....But in person they can gauge better for you on what you want , the range you are looking to spend, as well as to see what spas catch your eye, being in front of a tub and being able to sit in it is way better than trying to just look on the internet.....just my opinion....
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Well, I'm still trying to find a dealer that meets my needs. I've started contacting dealers in Charlotte, NC, roughly 70 miles from my home. Problem is, they don't respond when I ask them what they have in stock and what the prices are. Its like they want me to come down and see for myself. I already spent a day last week in Greensboro checking inventories and with gas costs being what they are, I'm not going anywhere else without knowing specifics. My initial thoughts on the hot tub industry is that it is not very user friendly. Local Craigslist has nothing but brand new Laguna spas with the exception of the used Caldera spa we looked at yesterday.
Its common for dealers to want you to come in and not want to try to make a deal over the phone. That doesn't mean they're not user friendly, it just means the world doesn't always go by your rules.
Heck, 70 miles isn't that major of a haul; I assumed you were even farther away than that. This is a big purchase; you need to spend the gas and time on a Saturday. Put your stubbornness aside and make the trek or just close your eyes, cross your fingers and buy on-line. Its really that simple.
I wasn't looking for a deal over the phone. I just wanted to know what was in stock and what the costs were, so that I could determine if it was worth the drive, reasonable requests for a potential $5000-$10000 sale. . Why would I just drive aimlessly all over North Carolina at $3.50 per gallon for the unknown. That would be unproductive and a waste of my valuable time. I wouldn't expect my tile customers to go through that for me. If they want my business, it will be on my terms or they won't get it. This mentality has served me quite well over my life and I have no intention of giving in to pushy salespersons.
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If they want my business, it will be on my terms or they won't get it. This mentality has served me quite well over my life and I have no intention of giving in to pushy salespersons.
And maybe that mentality is why you're not getting the responses you're looking for. If you called me and politely explained your situation I'd give you pricing even if that wasn't the norm and I'd spend time talking to you to see what might be a good fit. However, if you called with a "pushy" attitude driven by "it will be on my terms or ..." similar to your last two posts you'd get nowhere over the phone with me either.
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If they want my business, it will be on my terms or they won't get it. This mentality has served me quite well over my life and I have no intention of giving in to pushy salespersons.
I'm guessing the dealer has the same mentality!
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And there can't even be a good stare-down over the phone!
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If they want my business, it will be on my terms or they won't get it. This mentality has served me quite well over my life and I have no intention of giving in to pushy salespersons.
And maybe that mentality is why you're not getting the responses you're looking for. If you called me and politely explained your situation I'd give you pricing even if that wasn't the norm and I'd spend time talking to you to see what might be a good fit. However, if you called with a "pushy" attitude driven by "it will be on my terms or ..." similar to your last two posts you'd get nowhere over the phone with me either.
I don't contact ANYBODY with a "pushy" attitude. I am as polite and to the point as humanly possible when requesting information for a particular product or service. The majority of the time I am treated with kindness and respect, as a potential client should be treated and as I have been treating my customers for the 23 years I have been in business. Probably why I'm still in business while most contractors I know are unemployed or in a new career.
On the other hand, I have had more than my share of arrogant business people who act as if I am privileged to be in their presence. Persons who think they are the be-all and end-all and who prefer their prospective clients to be ignorant and just accept their word as the gospel. Yes, I would get nowhere with you and we would both be better off because of it.
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I don't contact ANYBODY with a "pushy" attitude. I am as polite and to the point as humanly possible when requesting information for a particular product or service. The majority of the time I am treated with kindness and respect, as a potential client should be treated and as I have been treating my customers for the 23 years I have been in business. Probably why I'm still in business while most contractors I know are unemployed or in a new career.
On the other hand, I have had more than my share of arrogant business people who act as if I am privileged to be in their presence. Persons who think they are the be-all and end-all and who prefer their prospective clients to be ignorant and just accept their word as the gospel. Yes, I would get nowhere with you and we would both be better off because of it.
I'm sorry I missunderstood you in your previous quotes. This quote sounds tons different.
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New development today. I found a local dealer just a few miles from my house. Totally forgot he was there and his store did not come up on local searches but I remember shopping there for a pool when we moved to NC in 2002. Anyway, he carries Baja tubs exclusively and also services all tubs which is good if I buy elsewhere. Anyway, a Baja tub that is comparable to the Jacuzzi and Sundance models I have looked at runs roughly $1000 cheaper and the warranty is excellent. Now for the $64,000 question. How do Baja tubs compare to the other tubs?? Thanks!
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New development today. I found a local dealer just a few miles from my house. Totally forgot he was there and his store did not come up on local searches but I remember shopping there for a pool when we moved to NC in 2002. Anyway, he carries Baja tubs exclusively and also services all tubs which is good if I buy elsewhere. Anyway, a Baja tub that is comparable to the Jacuzzi and Sundance models I have looked at runs roughly $1000 cheaper and the warranty is excellent. Now for the $64,000 question. How do Baja tubs compare to the other tubs?? Thanks!
Jacuzzi and Sundance are about a grand or 2 better in construction, longevity, componants and reliability IMO, but I guess the price reflects that. The local dealer may make all that go away for the first 6-8 years of ownership. After that you may not get much out of the Baja but you will likely get a few more years from Jacuzzi and Sundance.
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Would Baja be considered mid-level?
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Mid-level between an internet spa and a top tier spa purchased from a good local dealer - sure.
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Well, I like the warranty and I like that they are made in North Carolina not far from where I live, if that means anything.
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i thought Baja spas are in Arizona....I was on their site and thats what i thought i read, but could not find the warranty on their site, thats usually a red flag for me.... i would say mid level.. also not a fan of the filtration system as in a pressured system. All your contaminents gor thru the pump and heater before being filtered, it is an old style filtering system mainly used on pools ..
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Well, I like the warranty and I like that they are made in North Carolina not far from where I live, if that means anything.
Warranties are defined as good or bad based on how well the dealer/manufacturer back them, not by how well they're written. Heck, if you read the warranties for some of the on-line guys theirs will seem fine too until you need it.
Most all spa warranties are similarly written but what makes Hot Spring and Jacuzzi's warranty reputation good and Cal's not so good over the years is based on the history of how well the customer is taken care of. I don't know Baja and have no opinion of theirs because I don't know their reputation for backing it (or anything about them really).
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Baja's were made in Arizona but now they are made about 30-40 miles from where I live in North Carolina. On paper, their warranty rates with some of the better brands. As for how well they stand behind their product, I have no way of knowing. I'm doing as much research as I possibly can.
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Well, I'm still trying to find a dealer that meets my needs....problem is, they don't respond when I ask them what the prices are. Its like they want me to come down and see for myself. My initial thoughts on the hot tub industry is that it is not very user friendly....
I wasn't looking for a deal over the phone. I just wanted to know....what the costs were, so that I could determine if it was worth the drive....If they want my business, it will be on my terms or they won't get it. This mentality has served me quite well over my life and I have no intention of giving in to pushy salespersons.
Sales people are perceived to be pushy because they are trying to fit your needs and sell a product. You do the same in your business. There is also a relationship that you are entering into, and face to face is a great deal better for you than a voice on the phone that quotes a "specific model", at a specific price that you expect to be the same, IF you EVER came in. Chances are excellent that you would make a "faith" based decision to save the gas money, and consider their pricing to high without knowing WHY prices are what they are, or what is actually included.
IF you are worried about the cost of gas, what do you think the dealer should do when he has to drive to your location to provide a service? (I know, you expect it in the price).
IMO you are best advised to purchase your "investment grade" product from a relationship that will provide your satisfaction. So far, the only satisfaction you seem to be searching for is our advice on what to buy, but then comes price. I think your priorities are understandable, but then what do you know about the Hot Tub Industry. you say they are not "user friendly", but I would allege they are all "buyer friendly". You just don't like sales people. Many things today are beyond our control, but what is in our control is the perspective we keep, the attitude we adopt, and the actions we take.
One thing I am certain of, a fool and his money are easily separated, and you seem to fear interaction from dealers and salespeople, even though your business must "sell" product to your customer, do you do it on-line as well?
Do Not Be Overly Sensitive about the advice being given by others in this post, they are trying to help the unknowing to avoid self inflicted mistakes.
It seems that you have two fears here, buying the wrong thing, and paying too much. Your best defense to these fears would be education and that is what this forum is about. You don't need to take our advise, as it is given free of cost to you. Consider it to be only worth the price you pay.
"Trust and Confidence" is what you are looking for, you're not going to find it on the internet.
Best wishes and good luck.
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Well, I'm still trying to find a dealer that meets my needs....problem is, they don't respond when I ask them what the prices are. Its like they want me to come down and see for myself. My initial thoughts on the hot tub industry is that it is not very user friendly....
I wasn't looking for a deal over the phone. I just wanted to know....what the costs were, so that I could determine if it was worth the drive....If they want my business, it will be on my terms or they won't get it. This mentality has served me quite well over my life and I have no intention of giving in to pushy salespersons.
Sales people are perceived to be pushy because they are trying to fit your needs and sell a product. You do the same in your business. There is also a relationship that you are entering into, and face to face is a great deal better for you than a voice on the phone that quotes a "specific model", at a specific price that you expect to be the same, IF you EVER came in. Chances are excellent that you would make a "faith" based decision to save the gas money, and consider their pricing to high without knowing WHY prices are what they are, or what is actually included.
IF you are worried about the cost of gas, what do you think the dealer should do when he has to drive to your location to provide a service? (I know, you expect it in the price).
IMO you are best advised to purchase your "investment grade" product from a relationship that will provide your satisfaction. So far, the only satisfaction you seem to be searching for is our advice on what to buy, but then comes price. I think your priorities are understandable, but then what do you know about the Hot Tub Industry. you say they are not "user friendly", but I would allege they are all "buyer friendly". You just don't like sales people. Many things today are beyond our control, but what is in our control is the perspective we keep, the attitude we adopt, and the actions we take.
One thing I am certain of, a fool and his money are easily separated, and you seem to fear interaction from dealers and salespeople, even though your business must "sell" product to your customer, do you do it on-line as well?
Do Not Be Overly Sensitive about the advice being given by others in this post, they are trying to help the unknowing to avoid self inflicted mistakes.
It seems that you have two fears here, buying the wrong thing, and paying too much. Your best defense to these fears would be education and that is what this forum is about. You don't need to take our advise, as it is given free of cost to you. Consider it to be only worth the price you pay.
"Trust and Confidence" is what you are looking for, you're not going to find it on the internet.
Best wishes and good luck.
If I may address a few of your points;
I cannot speak for others but to me, sales people are perceived to be pushy when they are pushy. Are you saying this because you think sales people are never pushy?? Ever tried purchasing a new or used vehicle? I'm a salesperson and I know my craft as good as anyone. I do not need to be pushy to sell my services and I would venture to guess that the overwhelming majority if not all of my customers would tell you I was not pushy when I called on them.
Not sure I understand you gas question.
Maybe "not user friendly" was a poor choice of words. Lets just say, so far its not what I am accustomed to when searching for a product/service. On the positive side, I had a good experience at the local Baja dealer I visited yesterday. I felt very comfortable there but you guys are telling me that Baja tubs are not up to par with the better ones. Seems I can't win.
My tile business is not online. Not yet, anyway. Mostly referrals at this point.
I don't think I'm being overly sensitive. For the most part, I greatly appreciate the responses. I didn't like being labeled by the one member but that was isolated and not really a big deal. I pride myself in being a smart shopper. I have done quite well in my life with my purchases usually do to diligent research and the ability to weed out the undesirables. You couldn't be more correct when you say I should educate myself which is exactly what I'm doing on this forum. I have made it a point to be courteous and thankful for the help I have received on this forum and I appreciate you taking the time to post.
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I didn't like being labeled by the one member but that was isolated and not really a big deal.
I think your label was well deserved whether intended or not. Typing on a forum can be a tough deal because everyone will interpret YOUR words differently. We only label based on your words. The way we aproach sales people has a lot to do with how their attitude is skewed towards the person standing in front of them. The true person in charge at any showroom is the customer. But the staff will treat every customer differently. Most people are intimidated and most people go in expecting that.
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Can anyone give me info on a Thermospa Phoenix? Is this a good tub?
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Can anyone give me info on a Thermospa Phoenix? Is this a good tub?
Personally I have 2 lists I give people when they are searching; there are the spas I specifically like (Caldera, D1, Hot Spring, Jacuzzi, Marquis and Sundance) and the spas I would specicially avoid for one or more reasons (Cal, Master and Thermospas). There are certainly many other brands that I think are fine (Beachcomber, Artesian...) and many others that I have little opinion of one way or the other (Baja, Coast...) but in the end you ahve to decide what works for you but I really would not recommend a brand like Thermospas.
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That is very helpful information, thanks. My wife and I are going to look at a 2006 Jacuzzi J-365 later this afternoon that is being sold by a local homeowner. Maybe just maybe this is what we have been waiting for. The Thermospa is also local but I think we'll stay away based on the opinions here.
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no problem just here to help...
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My wife and I just came back from looking at the used Jacuzzi. It appeared to be in excellent shape but needs lighting, head rests and two jet controller nkobs. Still, the tub looked pristine and ran nice. If anyone can tell me roughly what those parts should cost, I would appreciate it.
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My wife and I just came back from looking at the used Jacuzzi. It appeared to be in excellent shape but needs lighting, head rests and two jet controller nkobs. Still, the tub looked pristine and ran nice. If anyone can tell me roughly what those parts should cost, I would appreciate it.
Head rests, control knobs a few hundred bucks. If you don't mind what year and what are they asking?
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2006 and $2900. I believe I know who has handled their servicing. Too late to call but I'll try tomorrow.
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We are still considering the used Jacuzzi and the Baja tubs. Today, I visited a showroom that carries Dynasty tubs. Would appreciate any relevant info you folks may have on that brand. Thanks.
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you might look at some of the other threads on this site and the other about the efficiency claims of Dynasty.....i believe about month to 2 months ago... ;D
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2006 and $2900. I believe I know who has handled their servicing. Too late to call but I'll try tomorrow.
Of the options you have found thus far, this is the one I would be trying to make work. IMO it should be closer to $2000 as is, but at least it is in the ball park. I would counter, or at least have the seller pay for the repairs.
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Well, thats what we thought also but the chick who is selling it has been elusive with answers when I asked her for servicing records. In her ad, she mentioned that the tub is still under warranty. The warranty, as I have come to find out is non transferable and when I told her she told me that I would just tell them (Jacuzzi service people) that it is the same owner and they wouldn't know the difference. She also put in her ad that the tub had led lighting. It does not. No lighting at all in fact. Knowing all this, I asked her what the lowest price she would take for the tub was and she responded by telling me she would take $100 off and thats it. Needless to say, my wife and I are highly uncomfortable with this seller at this point. This is obviously going to take some time and we're ok with that. I do like the Baja and Dynasty tubs which were a good deal cheaper than the Jacuzzi and Sundance ones.
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There may not be any service records, if there have not been any repairs needed thus far. I understand your concerns, about this seller, and I agree. That said, if it still is under warranty, one possibility to make a deal (assuming you like the tub)... would be for her to have the dealer check out the tub, fix the issues while she is still the owner, and show you the paperwork on the inspection and the repairs. Even better, perhaps you could be there for the repair, and ask the tech questions. At that point, if there tech has no concerns... I would probably do the deal, even if you have qualms about the seller. Even if you have an unforseen problem, you can pay for a lot of repairs for compared to the cost a new tub.
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I agree, gadfly. Problem is, she is the one who told me the tub has been serviced and then she conveniently forgets who did the service. We just have a funny feeling about her like she's hiding something. We also don't appreciate her misleading advertisement on Craigslist.Maybe if she lowered the cost more than just $100 as she offered, we would take a chance.
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It sounds to me that you are on a good path, to finding the right tub for you. As you are willing to be patient, you will find a good fit. For what it is worth, the moderator of this site owns a Dynasty, and from what I have read over the years, had good luck with it, with only a few issues. I have not heard anything about Baja, one way or the other. If you end up going that route, I would need a lot of information from the dealer on his experience, how long they have worked with Baja, why they selected them as their vendor, and enough info about the company and the product, to get comfortable. It may be a good option, and just isn't as well-known. Now if the dealer selected them primarily due to location, or pricing... ? Regardless, IMO having a local dealer, is better than an unknown internet seller.
It sounds that you are right to be wary about Jacuzzi seller. If you like the J365, I would ask the dealer if he has any used tubs available. That might also help you get him to give you what his real bottom line price is on a new one. I personally would still consider giving this woman an offer with a couple of options: a low-ball price ($2000?) that would give enough room to repair any unforseen issues, or full price with the tub inspected and repaired by the dealer, prior to the sale... but I don't mind a little risk in a deal in exchange for a lower price, if I feel I have my bases covered. Worst she can say is no, and you can move on.
Good luck!
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Yes, my wife and I are resigned to the fact that this is going to take longer than we had hoped. Patience is a virtue, right? Thats what my mom taught me. When we finally do get our dream tub, I will post details.