Hot Tub Forum

Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 07:41:43 am

Title: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 07:41:43 am
Long story, but I "may" be replacing my newly purchased Sundance Majesta. I'd love some recommendations based on the following needs:


Foot jets extremely important
Calf jets wanted
Good quality tub with excellent warranty and service history wanted
[/list]

If anyone has suggestions, please post them. This tub is almost perfect, not quite. I am extremely disappointed with the dealership (to the point of filing a BBB complaint). >:(
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Water Boy on January 06, 2009, 08:49:41 am
What happened Michiganwinter?? Is there any way to get the current problem/problems worked out still.?Sounds pretty serious if you are getting close to taking the spa back. Have you talked to Sundance at all about the issues? Hope things work out for you.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 09:03:15 am
Unfortunately the dealer and I are having trouble. They have a lot of guarantees, and one of them is to help with questions on water chemistry. Apparently helping is limited to 3 questions. Also, they have avoided a request to guarantee fixing the spa if Sundance goes under, finally saying they wouldn't when they thought my 30-day return policy was up (this waiting until they thought my return policy expired is what really upsets me). It wasn't, it is up tomorrow. I have already put in writing that I want to return the tub. I am livid at the treatment I have received after spending a boatload of money on a tub. I bought through them a) because they are local, b) because they stressed customer service as priority c) because I like the tub a lot.  I am very sad about the situation. No matter what the resolution I can't see dealing with this dealer again.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Water Boy on January 06, 2009, 11:31:07 am
MW,

I am sorry to hear that. It is too bad that you say that you love your tub, but that you want to return it. What if you return it and you are never as happy as you are now with the one you already have installed? Then you might forever regret that decision. I could have sworn you wanted to buy this tub because you loved your local dealer as he had been in biz for over 30 years.

The spa is warranted by Sundance, not by the dealer, so if Sundance were to go under(which I would be floored if this happened,) the warranty no longer exists. I don't know of any dealer that would put this in writing.

As far as water chemistry questions go, your dealer should be helping you with that. Be persistent and keep asking questions. There is no limit to questions with new customers on water chemistry. But, feel free to ask questions here too about your water as this place is a great resource for that.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 12:21:38 pm
Thanks Beerman (and my private message), at this point I really don't know what to do. I have to make the decision to return the tub or not right away. That is if the company honors their written word or not...  I have been looking at other tubs and no one seems to have the smaller tub with the foot jets. As the foot jets are by far the most popular feature of the tub, I am kind of at a loss right now. I don't think I am an unreasonable purchaser. Maybe I am, but to me customer service wins or breaks deals every day, and to stay in business this long, they should be good at it. Maybe something is happening that makes them feel like they will be going out of business themselves and therefore are no longer customer service oriented, or maybe I am a beaactch...
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Jacuzzi Jim on January 06, 2009, 12:54:38 pm
 Relax!!   Keep the spa, unless your just so pissed it doesn't matter at this point??     The only real fault I see is the lack of chemical help.   Sundance/Jacuzzi spa's are not going anywhere!!!  Your dealer on the other hand who knows??

  Has your spa had any troubles at all??  Doesn't sound like it.   I know its not right the way they are treating you regarding chem help, but until your spa has a real problem for them to take care of I wouldn't sweat it.  Seek chem help elsewhere, like here or another store.

  Have you talked to management/owner yet??

 Please don't take what I said the wrong way, but I would give it a bit more time and bring some questions here regarding your chemical problem.

Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: hottubdan on January 06, 2009, 01:17:59 pm
See my PMs.

I sense there is more going on here than meets the eye.  Odds are Sundance is not going away.  If you do choose to return the spa, check out the Hot Spring Sovereign and Caldera Martinique.  Both are about the same size as your current spa and have great jets.

Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Kialda on January 06, 2009, 01:19:51 pm
I am sorry You are having trouble, But after that last post... I believe one of your previous comments hit the nail on the head. I believe you said.." or maybe I am a beaactch..."

Someone needs a nap..
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 01:38:45 pm
Quote
I am sorry You are having trouble, But after that last post... I believe one of your previous comments hit the nail on the head. I believe you said.." or maybe I am a beaactch..."

Someone needs a nap..

 ;D

Really, I paid 10K plus for the tub and within 3 days of buying it find information about Sundance in jeopardy (had researched it before here and felt more confident, then someone posts and new and scary link about the possible demise). If you had this much money just invested in a tub, what would you do?
Title: Re:
Post by: Kialda on January 06, 2009, 01:40:59 pm
Quote

let me see if I got this right... You purchased a spa because it fits your needs and you stated you were happy with both the spa and the dealership. You even said you loved the spa I believe.
  It is no surprise that you have water chemistry problems. I believe it is talked about often on this site with spa owners in the first 30 days. Most of the problems honestly are from customers using to much chemicals or simply paying to much attention to there spa, as well as new user heavy use. There are many ways to maintain a spa and many different chemicals. Stick with one system, Most of the problems I see are from people taking advice from to many cheifs and ending up using parts of 3 different systems. All would work but only if they are used seperatly.
   I believe they have been in contact with you and offered to test your water for free, and are trying to make it simple for you.
    So you buy your spa from them, they deliver the spa you bought and install it with all the accys and such as promised. Then you read a post on this forum by a Hot Springs salesman trying to slam Sundance by saying they may be going under and you get concerned. You now try to hold your dealer to a new contract after the fact that is just simply rediculous. Your pissed because you want to change the terms after the fact and want an addl warranty that was not discussed at the time of the purchase.
   Now due to a simple water quality issue in the first 30 days, and you trying to change the terms, You file a claim with the BBB, you rant on an open forum, You threaten to return your spa, you attempt to bait and gain support from others by making them think you could possible by a spa from them in the future.
     is there more??
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Jacuzzi Jim on January 06, 2009, 01:44:26 pm
 After reading your last post as well, you didn't need to delete it??

 I think your gripe is a legitimate one regarding the chem issues, and no 3 questions are not a lot!!  Jeez I give people my home phone to call if they are having trouble when I am not here, but I don't believe it warrants returning the spa because of it.

 The second is they have been in business a very long time by the sounds of it, so they must do something right?
I would think they would take care of you if you have a problem least one would hope.

  Curious are there any other complaints with the BBB??  
Title: Re: Re:
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 01:47:38 pm
Quote

let me see if I got this right... You purchased a spa because it fits your needs and you stated you were happy with both the spa and the dealership. You even said you loved the spa I believe.
  It is no surprise that you have water chemistry problems. I believe it is talked about often on this site with spa owners in the first 30 days. Most of the problems honestly are from customers using to much chemicals or simply paying to much attention to there spa, as well as new user heavy use. There are many ways to maintain a spa and many different chemicals. Stick with one system, Most of the problems I see are from people taking advice from to many cheifs and ending up using parts of 3 different systems. All would work but only if they are used seperatly.
   I believe they have been in contact with you and offered to test your water for free, and are trying to make it simple for you.
    So you buy your spa from them, they deliver the spa you bought and install it with all the accys and such as promised. Then you read a post on this forum by a Hot Springs salesman trying to slam Sundance by saying they may be going under and you get concerned. You now try to hold your dealer to a new contract after the fact that is just simply rediculous. Your pissed because you want to change the terms after the fact and want an addl warranty that was not discussed at the time of the purchase.
   Now due to a simple water quality issue in the first 30 days, and you trying to change the terms, You file a claim with the BBB, you rant on an open forum, You threaten to return your spa, you attempt to bait and gain support from others by making them think you could possible by a spa from them in the future.
     is there more??

I never tried to hold them to a new warranty, just honor the one they have. Want all the emails? Sounds like you are this dealer. If you are, you should have them?
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 01:50:25 pm
Quote
After reading your last post as well, you didn't need to delete it??

 I think your gripe is a legitimate one regarding the chem issues, and no 3 questions are not a lot!!  Jeez I give people my home phone to call if they are having trouble when I am not here, but I don't believe it warrants returning the spa because of it.

 The second is they have been in business a very long time by the sounds of it, so they must do something right?
I would think they would take care of you if you have a problem least one would hope.

  Curious are there any other complaints with the BBB??  

Looks like 4 questions when I re-read.

There are no other complaints with the BBB. They were clean. I liked them, it was the reason I went with them. I have gotten really angry over the last email from the owner. The timing is strategic. I simply tried to get them to answer this question: "Can one of you please assure me in writing that either you will honor the 5-year parts and labor warranty if they go under or what my options are?"  It never got answered and the last email from them put in 10-years which I have no idea where it comes from since it isn't in any of my emails that I sent.
Title: Re: Re:
Post by: Kialda on January 06, 2009, 01:55:41 pm
Quote

I never tried to hold them to a new warranty, just honor the one they have. Want all the emails? Sounds like you are this dealer. If you are, you should have them?


I am thousands of miles away from you, but the fact that you need to delete your posts shows me what type of person you are. I could read right thru this. There is always 2 sides and you have already shown to be unreasonable, excitable, and not completely truthfull.
  
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 02:02:33 pm
By the way, I am airing this precisely because I have waited almost 24 hours with no response (only to call) and my 30-days is up tomorrow, so I feel time is of the essence. I always keep an email chain because it is very easy to forget what is said as opposed to what is written.

The dealer was chosen because of being in business a long time and my feeling that they were really good. The breakdown happened when the owner finally responded about the warranty (thinking 10-years, not 5-years, from out of the blue - still only see a reference to the 10K I paid, not 10-year anything) when the comment was that I had it for 30-days already. The dealer has a 30-day no question return policy, so this is very concerning. I wrote back saying I needed everything in writing. They haven't written back, and yes, I have checked the spam folder.

I guess I am a bitch, but I spent a lot of money and I just wanted some simple assurance that they would take care of me, or at least tell me my options (in writing). Had they ever done this, before they thought my return was up, we never would have had any issues at all.

Kailda, you are right, I freaked out about the negative posting about Sundance, but I asked you the question, what would you have done, and you did not respond.

Thanks for the help everybody, in particular the PMs.
Title: Re: Re:
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 02:05:26 pm
Quote


I am thousands of miles away from you, but the fact that you need to delete your posts shows me what type of person you are. I could read right thru this. There is always 2 sides and you have already shown to be unreasonable, excitable, and not completely truthfull.
  

I deleted them because they were inflammatory and I didn't think that was necessary. I rethought it and thought it was better to stay professional, and deleted them within a couple of minutes. If that says I am unreasonable, excitable and not completely truthful it is rather surprising. I would think it meant that I rethought a rash response.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Kialda on January 06, 2009, 02:28:19 pm
I bought a new chevy truck last month,

I love the truck, the dealer, they have been around 30 years and have no BBB issues.
It is the model I want, everything works great, and it was delivered on time.

After driving it for a couple weeks, the damn truck keeps running red lights. I sent numerous emails to the dealer and he offered to give me operational lessons but I just dont think that is enough as I keep running red lights.

I now hear if chevey does not get the intended bail out they may go bankrupt. I asked the dealer if they would also provide in writing to me that they would give me a personal warranty above and beyond the chevy warranty as I am concerned about them going bankrupt. I heard some Ford guy talk about this on a thread and I believe it cause hey, someone typed it..

Since I am not happy with my resolution to my operational issues so far, and I have got no response as to the new warranty guarantee I would like, I am going to file with the BBB, I am going to complain on threads on the internet and I am going to return my truck..
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 02:29:34 pm
you still have not said what you would do.

If you had the option to return the truck, would you?
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Jacuzzi Jim on January 06, 2009, 04:18:42 pm
I would say do what you need to, to be happy!!    But,  I think you should stick to what you have and seek advise elsewhere chem wise.  
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Cdn HockeyPuck on January 06, 2009, 04:37:10 pm
I agree with JJ. Everyone is has their own happy point, some might be on it being happy the spa and living with the occasional glitch from a dealer, others want a dealer at their beck and call.

The problem with email is it doesn't show emotion, so your emails from the dealer could be confusion. I don't know.  If you talk face to face with them does it seem like they don't care about you. Body language says the most during a conversation than words or how it sounds (or so all the courses on communication I've been on say).

If you've wet tested other spas and this is the one you really liked it could be the reason to keep it. For a dealer that's been around 30 years and no complaints on the BBB they must have some happy customers. See if you can contact some of them to get their experiences with the deaier.

Also, I had the same problems with water chemistry my first month, you're not alone, this forum is a gold mine for information on trying to fix it.  I haven't used my dealer for water chemistry issues and have relied on this forum.

Good luck in your decision!
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Vanguard on January 06, 2009, 05:09:11 pm
I can't say I would require the dealer to be responsible for honoring Sundance's warranty if Sundance goes out of business.  That is unfair to the dealer.  The dealer relies on Sundance to reimburse them for parts and labor for warranty issues.  Trust me, they are not eating the cost of warranty work.  If the dealer had to eat the warranty work, the spas would be much more expensive.

Sundance is a public company.  As such, they should have a warranty reserve for every spa they have built.  I don't know who would administer the warranty reserve should a company go out of business, but that reserve is there for the protection of the consumer.  

I remember folks at Watkins talking about their reserve and how much it costs them for every spa sold.  They have to put it in a separate account that they can't touch.  That is part of the reason spas from public companies are more expensive.  They are held to a higher standard in regard to their warranty reserves.

So, should any publicly held company go out of business, their customers should be taken care of.



Now, I don't know what other issues you're having other than water chemistry, but if that's it, I don't think you should return your spa since you really like it.  Just find another dealer to buy your chemicals from.  They all do free water testing when you buy from them.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 05:11:56 pm
I am sticking with the tub because it is what I wanted and I am not going to let them ruin my enjoyment of it. I am very angry though and am going to voice this with the appropriate parties since I did not reach resolution.

For the dealers out there, remember customer service is such a large part of this business. The dealer does have a huge role to play in the decision making process and can alienate customers quickly by being snappy and less than helpful. Prompt response and being polite goes a long way to helping keep satisfied customers. Since customers are what pay the bills, and this is a very large purchase, customer relations should come first. The first dealer turned me off with puffery and negative comments, the dealer I ended up with turned me off with what I believe to be false advertising. While the customer isn't always right, the customer should never be treated with condescension or derision.

Cheers, Rachel
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Jacuzzi Jim on January 06, 2009, 08:13:42 pm
  So what kind of problems are you exactly having???
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: hottubdan on January 06, 2009, 08:19:58 pm
Quote
I can't say I would require the dealer to be responsible for honoring Sundance's warranty if Sundance goes out of business.  That is unfair to the dealer.  The dealer relies on Sundance to reimburse them for parts and labor for warranty issues.  Trust me, they are not eating the cost of warranty work.  If the dealer had to eat the warranty work, the spas would be much more expensive.

Sundance is a public company.  As such, they should have a warranty reserve for every spa they have built.  I don't know who would administer the warranty reserve should a company go out of business, but that reserve is there for the protection of the consumer.  




.

I thought when Apollo bought Jacuzzi/Sundance they took it private.  I think Watkins, as part of Masco, is the only publicly traded manufacturer in the industry.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Zep on January 06, 2009, 08:45:45 pm
Michigan......sometimes when I get something new I micro everything and tend to panic
if something is not just right.....but later when I look back I tell myself jezzzz it wasn't
such a big deal after-all.

Look...you have a great tub made by a top of the line company that has been around a
long time. Sundance is probably not going under and even if they did someone would buy
them. It's highly unlikely they would just shut down.

Everybody at first gets frustrated by the chemical issues.....don't panic.

Talk to owner of the dealership.

A month from now you be happily soaking instead of starting over.

Enjoy your Sundance....it's a great tub!
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Bonibelle on January 06, 2009, 08:49:58 pm
Michigan, For what it's worth, I think that you may have a bit of buyer's remorse complicated by the fear that the brand of tub that you purchased must not be of good enough quality to stay in business. That is not true.

Because I sometimes succumb to the same kind of thought process, I will tell you to relax.
Your issues are probably not as big as you have imagined them to be. If you are like me, you wake up at night and they are HUGE....

So maybe look at things like this: You have a beautiful tub that you researched and chose for all the right reasons. EVERY business is questionable in this economy, so buying another brand will not guarantee that the dealer or even the company will survive this economic mess.
YES 10,000 is a chunk of change and I am thinking that it is not just the threat of Sundance going under that scares you about spending that kind of money..it's the reality that spending that much money today for anything is just plain scarey!! So if you do return the tub, will you really purchase another or will you feel the need to hang on to that money?

Your water issues shouldn't even be a real issue. No one pestered these guys or asked goofier questions about water management than I did..I am laughing now because I bought a white board and posted it by my back door to write a log of everything that I was doing to analyze my gooped up tub. A couple of the guys on here couldn't believe it! So if nothing else, we can help you solve you water problems.

After tomorrow, there will be nothing that you can do. So let tomorrow come and go, enjoy your tub and don't worry about needing warranty work. As my husband always tells me.."Don't cry before you're hurt". It will be fine and once you are past tomorrow, your buyer remorse will go away and you will be glad that you have your tub.
Oh..and to put all the anxiety to bed..you need to have a nice talk with your dealer. I am sure he will understand.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Bonibelle on January 06, 2009, 08:51:25 pm
Oh Zep...you amaze me...Men are NOT supposed to understand us... :o

(and you beat me to every point to boot!!)
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 06, 2009, 09:15:36 pm
Unfortunately it was the owner of the company who I believe caused the trouble. Had the owner simply put in writing that they couldn't warrant it if the Sundance went under, but would do everything in their power to try and make things right if there was an issue, then everything would have been fine. It was the refusal to put anything in writing that bothers me. I asked to have them stand by the warranty OR tell me what they could do. That never got answered until the dealer said I had the tub for 30-day, relax and enjoy (perhaps it was nothing nefarious, but the refusal to answer for 20+ days and then answering at what they thought was the 30-day mark really bothers me). Even then I wouldn't have been too bent out of shape had I not been basically chastised for asking too many questions about balancing the water.

Spending a large chunk of change definitely is worrisome in this day and age, but I have high blood pressure and sleeping and relaxing problems, so bought a tub to help so I don't have a coronary with excessive stress (job related). It is money well spent and I like the tub a lot and am happy with it. I am just very unhappy being treated like I am on the slow side and don't understand. I was referred to read the owners manual if I had questions, yet the owners manual refers me to talk to the dealer about water chemistry. I couldn't find the ozonator symbol light on the tub and it isn't in the manual. I simply asked the sales person about it and if it was possibly not installed, but then Monday morning I saw the light on (finally) and wrote to tell them it was on and no worries. That is when I got the letter back stating I was asking way more questions than normal and to refer to the manual, that they wouldn't warrant the tub in the event of Sundance going under, and I had the tub 30-days so relax.

When I first posted this thread, I wanted to know if there were other options, not air a gripe. I am sorry I did, but I also think it is important for dealers to know what goes through the minds of their customers, and that customers do matter, for without us, none of them would have any business. I am not going to air any of my grievances on this forum any further.

I really appreciate those who offered positive input. Thanks for offering a freaked out newbie some help. This is how a internet forum helps when experienced people offer sound advice. Thanks
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Kialda on January 06, 2009, 10:44:17 pm
Well you did buy a spa, and you bought a great spa with an outstanding warranty. It is truly sad that some Hot Springs salesman got you worked up and felt you had to attempt to pressure the company you purchased that spa from for an addl warranty guaranteed by them.
   Here was a 30 year old company without a single BBB complaint against them. Well they now have one. Those dont go away. I hope in the future when you need real service and you call that dealer, you come back on here and post how they came out and repaired your spa.
   5 Years is a long time, and I am sure you are aware this was a difficult way to begin that relationship. If they have been in business that long and have that great of a reputation, I am sure they will not remember that when you call them for service on a friday night. Again I hope you will take the time to come back and tell everyone how you have been treated over the next 5 years.
   The BCB " Better Consumers Bureau" was started many years ago. It is a private company for profit like the BBB with a data base for retailers for consumers that have not paid bills, bounced checks, acted rudley,  posted trash, DOA  "Drunk on arrival". And many other reasons. As a consumer you can pay to be a member and you are guaranteed you will never have a complaint against your name. I dont know if Your dealer is a member, but I am sure they will not list you.
  Everything has two sides, most problems can be resolved with communication. Most people enjoy doing good business with good people.. Most people will go out of there way to make someone else happy, a simple thank you goes a long way. You catch so many more bees with honey..
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Kawwboy on January 06, 2009, 10:52:43 pm
What she said!!!

After having my tub for a year now....I can understand why my dealer would roll his eyes at me when I would ask him about chems. Then he would say, don't over think it.

The other day I stopped in to pick up some supplies. We talked about Sundance and warranty. He said he would try and take of any issues...did not seem too worried at all. Not many problems with the tubs. Makes you feel better.

Warmer here today....just got in from a -2 soak.
I was sitting in the tub wondering, if the three feet of snow along the path, to the tub, would hurt my deck.

Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: D.P. Roberts on January 06, 2009, 11:03:43 pm
Here's something else to consider:

A very smart person on this board (I can't remember who) posted a different "30 day rule". This rule is that all new spa owners should drain their spas & refill after 30 days. The idea is that new spa owners tend to get obsessive about their new $10000K investments, and fiddle with the chemicals constantly - to the point that they've basically ruined the water in the first month. So, after the first month of chemical paranoia, you drain, refill, and become a "normal" hot tub user.

I think you're going through the same thing with your tub. I know I did with my first one. When your dealer said that you were asking way more questions than normal, perhaps he or she was simply trying to suggest that you "chill out" and enjoy your new tub. Worrying and constantly messing with chemicals is stressful for you & it's not helping your tub either.

Personally, my ideal tub would be mid-sized, with open seating and great foot jets. If I could have any tub in the world, I'd pick a Sundance Majesta. And although I know next to nothing about the hot tub industry, if I was worried about a company going under I'd pick one that's diversified (like Apollo/Jacuzzi or Masco/Watkins) and call it a pretty safe bet.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Vanguard on January 06, 2009, 11:21:33 pm
Quote

I thought when Apollo bought Jacuzzi/Sundance they took it private.  I think Watkins, as part of Masco, is the only publicly traded manufacturer in the industry.


Yeah, kind of forgot about that.  You're right.  Hopefully, since I'd assume Apollo would eventually like to sell Jacuzzi and make a profit, they are continuing to fund the warranty reserve.  Just because you're a private manufacturer doesn't mean you shouldn't have a reserve.  Companies that want to be sold should have this as an asset to sell.  The company becomes much more valuable.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: Vanguard on January 06, 2009, 11:24:32 pm
Quote

Look...you have a great tub made by a top of the line company that has been around a
long time. Sundance is probably not going under and even if they did someone would buy
them. It's highly unlikely they would just shut down.



I'm sure Sharper Image, Bombay, Linens N Things, et al, thought the same thing.  But they are all gone.

I'm not saying Sundance will, I have no clue as to their finances.  I'm just saying there is no guarantee in this climate that a failing business will be purchased.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 07, 2009, 10:09:24 am
Quote
Well you did buy a spa, and you bought a great spa with an outstanding warranty. It is truly sad that some Hot Springs salesman got you worked up and felt you had to attempt to pressure the company you purchased that spa from for an addl warranty guaranteed by them.
   Here was a 30 year old company without a single BBB complaint against them. Well they now have one. Those dont go away. I hope in the future when you need real service and you call that dealer, you come back on here and post how they came out and repaired your spa.
   5 Years is a long time, and I am sure you are aware this was a difficult way to begin that relationship. If they have been in business that long and have that great of a reputation, I am sure they will not remember that when you call them for service on a friday night. Again I hope you will take the time to come back and tell everyone how you have been treated over the next 5 years.
   The BCB " Better Consumers Bureau" was started many years ago. It is a private company for profit like the BBB with a data base for retailers for consumers that have not paid bills, bounced checks, acted rudley,  posted trash, DOA  "Drunk on arrival". And many other reasons. As a consumer you can pay to be a member and you are guaranteed you will never have a complaint against your name. I dont know if Your dealer is a member, but I am sure they will not list you.
  Everything has two sides, most problems can be resolved with communication. Most people enjoy doing good business with good people.. Most people will go out of there way to make someone else happy, a simple thank you goes a long way. You catch so many more bees with honey..

Klaida, what I don't get is where you keep saying that I was asking for an additional warranty. I never ever did. All I asked was for them to warrant it. My specific question, via email (twice) was: "Can one of you please assure me in writing that either you will honor the 5-year parts and labor warranty if they go under or what my options are?"
I don't understand where you are getting your information on asking for an additional warranty since I just wanted assurance that they would cover the tub.

As to the last paragraph; I was hoping to have a good relationship. I was very nice whenever I dealt with them except with regard to getting something in writing which I do require.

Anyway, I am not airing this issue other than again defending my comments that I never asked for an additional warranty, period.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: clover on January 08, 2009, 09:19:03 am
Michiganwinter, A warranty is provided by the manufacturer, not the dealer.  If the manufacturer goes out of business or changes hands it still remains to be the manufacturers warranty or responsibility.  Sundance, which was once privately owned then accquired by Jacuzzi, has changed hands and is now owned by Apollo.  They assume the previous warranty obligations in the price they accquired the company for.  That makes Sundance / Jacuzzi an old name but new owners with a specific focus.  

The dealer is only the service provider.  They too have an obligation to you to provide the service to implement the warranty.  If the manufacturer is gone defunct, you are asking the dealer to assume the obligation of the manufacturer to provide the parts.  The Manufacture has set aside money in the wholesale cost to provide the warranty obligations.

Your dealer is new to the Hot Tub industry and has been selling spas for about a year now.  He has had no hot tub experience otherwise in his past 30 years of their "family business".  You are expecting him to give you something in writing that will say that he will assume the manufacturer's obligation to you if they go out of business.  On the other hand, who will be providing the services when your dealer decides the Hot Tub businees is not for him or the economy takes him down too like Insideout who went BK.  You are expecting to get something in writing that is not going to happen.  Why are you so gripped with fear of failure in the future.

Enjoy the Hot Tub and the next five years will be over befor you even know it.  you may never have to call for service.  
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: hottubdan on January 08, 2009, 12:11:19 pm
Quote
Michiganwinter, A warranty is provided by the manufacturer, not the dealer.  If the manufacturer goes out of business or changes hands it still remains to be the manufacturers warranty or responsibility.  Sundance, which was once privately owned then accquired by Jacuzzi, has changed hands and is now owned by Apollo.  They assume the previous warranty obligations in the price they accquired the company for.  That makes Sundance / Jacuzzi an old name but new owners with a specific focus.  

The dealer is only the service provider.  They too have an obligation to you to provide the service to implement the warranty.  If the manufacturer is gone defunct, you are asking the dealer to assume the obligation of the manufacturer to provide the parts.  The Manufacture has set aside money in the wholesale cost to provide the warranty obligations.

Your dealer is new to the Hot Tub industry and has been selling spas for about a year now.  He has had no hot tub experience otherwise in his past 30 years of their "family business".  You are expecting him to give you something in writing that will say that he will assume the manufacturer's obligation to you if they go out of business.  On the other hand, who will be providing the services when your dealer decides the Hot Tub businees is not for him or the economy takes him down too like Insideout who went BK.  You are expecting to get something in writing that is not going to happen.  Why are you so gripped with fear of failure in the future.

Enjoy the Hot Tub and the next five years will be over befor you even know it.  you may never have to call for service.  

You are the voice of reason.
Title: Re: New tub suggestion
Post by: michiganwinter on January 08, 2009, 12:40:30 pm
Thank you Clover, I really wish the dealer would have put something like that in writing. It makes sense and explains the process. Note I did ask what my options were, and here you explained it. This type of communication is good customer service (and you don't even sell this spa I assume).  FTR, I checked the state business website and they have been in business as a spa shop since 1985, not one year. Perhaps you are thinking of someone else.

I am going to relax and enjoy the heck out of my tub and hope I never have to have a service call.