Hot Tub Forum
Original => Hot Tub Forum => Topic started by: beaugart_mr on June 07, 2007, 02:51:20 pm
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would someone please tell me if a pad is a bad way to go? Looking at a Sundance Chelsee or Hot Springs Vanguard and not sure if a pad would work for either, or if a pad works at all.
thanks
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When you say "pad" what do you mean? A plastic portable pad that some dealers sell or a cement pad?
A renforced cement pad is considered to be on of the best foundation for a hot tub and is usuall the prefered methods by the manufactuers.
Those spa pads are a different story. You will still need a solid level surface to put the spa pad on.
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yes, that is what I mean, a portable plastic pad. I will be installing the tub on grass...it is level, but nevertheless it is on grass.
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I would put down a base (crushed stone or compaceted sand) and then the base.
I have a compacted sand on top of pavers and it's worked out fine for me.
What did your dealer say?
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Yup, you still should have a solid base under whatever pad you use.
Especially if you live in the frost belt.
As for the pads themselves, I'm aware of 2 EZ Pad installs, both over 4 years old, and both doing okay. But both have a solid level base underneath.
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I am very intetrested to see where this thread goes....
I just put down a deposit on a Sundance Cameo yesterday. We got home and looked at our proposed locacation a little closer, and disconvered that it might not wotk at all. It would have been partially on the pool deck and partially on the patio. The probem is the the pool desk has aslight slope away from the pool and the patio is flat. After laying a 6 foot straight pice of metal across teh area, there is about 1/3 inch free space under the metal,wher the patio and pool deck come together.
So started looking at the yard. Whick honestly is probably better, the pool deck/ patio area would have been very crowded.
So I called my dealer and asked about alternatives, ( I had already checked out some plactic type pads on the net). He was all for the portable pads, said they worked fine. It would take 4 pads, 50x50, $150 each. Suggested that I atleast cut the grass as far down as possible and then take the weed eather and get it done as far as possible. Of course removing the turf and putting in a sand or gravel base would probably be better.
But right now, the more that I have to do, the longer this is going to take.
So lets hear from some users that used the protable pads?
I really dont want to pour concrete.
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that is where I am with this...I want portable to be portable...not worry that if I decide to move the spa that I have a concrete slab I need to knock out. One outfit was pushing the pad and another was not (they lay their own slab). I live in Southern California so elements are not extreme.
So what I am gathering is that if I do put a pad down, it would be smart to lay it on pea gravel instead of directly on the grass.
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that is where I am with this...I want portable to be portable...not worry that if I decide to move the spa that I have a concrete slab I need to knock out.
I'm not sure of your current patio configuration but adding to what's already there will not only give you the space you need for a spa but will actually add to the value of your house. The second best thing to raise your houses value is outdoor living space.
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I've had my spa a little over a year. I put mine on a plastic pad. I wasn't positive that the spot where we put it wasn't going to change. We knew it would be easier to move if it was on a pad. We used a gas powered sod cutter and removed the grass, leveled with sand and put the pads down. Very fast installation and it's still level and stable. I don't regret the decision at all. We have since installed a brick patio around it. Looks great.
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I also looked into the plastic pads but opted against it mainly do to cost. I would highly recommend that you get down to the dirt, use sand or a crushed limestone base, compacted and leveled and then place the plastic pad on top of it and you should be fine.
I ended up pouring a concrete slab using Sakrete but did things a bit differently and it ended up costing me far less than the plastic pads and looks alot better in my opinion. My tub is 7X7, so I made a 10X10 frame out of treated lumbar and bolted it together. THem I put cross pieces of wood inside the frame to seperate it into smaller sections so I didnt have to mix all the concrete at one time for ease of working with it. Over 4-5 days I poured it all and then I took the same wood decking I have on my deck and covered the entire slab with it by screwing it into the frame and the cross members. I then stained it to match my elevated deck and put in a 2nd set of stairs down to it. The entire cost was about $500. Then I decided to offset the tub into the corner leaving a 3 foot area down 2 sides, leaving room to walk down one side to open the cover and 3 ft in front of the tub for steps/platform that I just built.
It turned out pretty nice, not as easy as the plastic pads but I think the end result was better.
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We have our Envoy on the portable pads. We have had no problems. We removed the sod, put down a buttload of sand, tamped it down, then put the pads down. It was/and is (18 months later) completely level.
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I didn't want to pour concrete, so I did this:
(http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i20/aegdvm/P1000750.jpg)
(http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i20/aegdvm/P1000755.jpg)
(http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i20/aegdvm/P1000762.jpg)
(http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i20/aegdvm/P1000894.jpg)
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Anne,
that looks FANTASTIC! Wanna come over to my place and redo everything Ive just done?? :)
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Whether you use concrete or a spa pad, the key is what is beneath it. Do not place pads on grass. Remove grass and topsoil, replace with a crushed gravel, compact and your spa pads should work fine.
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as i recall, when i was looking at a sundance booklet that described how to get ready for delivery, i believe that there was a mention of spa pads as not advisable. i no longer have that booklet but it probably still exsists if you want to go out and find it. i could be totally wrong however. anne's solution is good by the looks of it. pavers are another way to go. i cannot imagine that a grass surface is dead level, but it is i am sure.
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That wasn't the case when I bought my Optima- a 2003 model. All it said was that their preferred or suggested base was at least 4" of concrete, but it didn't say not to use spa pads. In fact, the dealer I got my spa from was sold the pads.
Damage caused by a poor base won't be covered under warranty- but that's true for ANY base.
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i agree brew...i said not advisable which is short of forbidden to do so...........crete is the best, pavers second.......a spa on pad without a reinforced foundation will settle.
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The Sundance website has a downloadable pdf brochure for accessories which include the spa pads. They actually show them resting on grass though I wouldn't do it.
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I've had my Marquis on a Pad for 4 years with no problem. I placed mine where my kid's swing set had been. After taking up the mulch I put down 2 inches of construction sand (not play sand). Then leveled it with a 10 ft 2x4. Placed the pad down and it was fine. the pad had a 3/4 inch over 8 ft slope and it hasn't changed a bit.
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I would put down a base (crushed stone or compaceted sand) and then the base.
I have a compacted sand on top of pavers and it's worked out fine for me.
What did your dealer say?
same here
I removed the sod, put down some crushed stone. I then layered in sand & pavers.
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I've had my Marquis on a Pad for 4 years with no problem. I placed mine where my kid's swing set had been. After taking up the mulch I put down 2 inches of construction sand (not play sand). Then leveled it with a 10 ft 2x4. Placed the pad down and it was fine. the pad had a 3/4 inch over 8 ft slope and it hasn't changed a bit.
jsut curious, what's the difference between "construction" and "play" sand? Why the distinction? I knw nothing about sand, but I thougth "play sand" was cleaner and finer and therefore would compact better, no?
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Your right play sand is very fine almost powder like where construction sand is much coarse. When I talked to the Handi-pad folks they specifically said to use either a fine gravel or construction grade sand. They specifically said not to use play sand but I don't remember why.
Here is their instuctions off their site
Handi-Spa Pad
Installation Instructions
To make an 8’ x 8’ square pad you need 2 cartons (6 pads).
To make an 8’ x 12’ rectangular pad you need 3 cartons (9 pads).
To make a 10’-8” x 12’ rectangular pad you need 4 cartons (12 pads).
The Handi-Spa Pad is an all-plastic pad, measuring 32” x 48”, that can be connected together, with the supplied connectors, in any configuration to form a flat platform for placement of a spa. Installation is easy.
The Handi-Spa Pad can be drilled through to run electrical conduit if needed.
Tools Required: Shovel, Level, 2x4
Also required: Sand – approximately 80 lbs required for each pad for a 1” layer.
Place the Handi-Spa Pad on any level, well-drained surface. It can also be installed under spas on existing decks or concrete pads to help improve the insulation factor.
Start the installation by removing any sod and leveling out the dirt surface. A long (8ft) wooden 2x4 is a handy tool to use along with your level. After leveling tamp the dirt down to form a firm base.
To help assist the leveling process a 1” to 2” layer of sand or fine gravel should be installed next. Use the long2x4 and a level to get the sand as level as possible. Tamp the sand down to form a firm base.
Note that the spa pads are placed “waffle” side down on the ground and no connectors are needed between pads #2 and #5. Remove the connectors, which are located in the pockets in the back of each pad. The end of each connector marked “A” must go in the corresponding “A” Slots. Start with one of the pads and snap four of
the connectors into the slots marked “A”. Referencing the diagram below place the pad into position #1. Take a second pad and snap two of the connectors into the side “A” slots. Connect pad #2 to pad #1. Take a third pad
and snap two connectors into the end “A” slots. Connect pad #3 to pad #2. Take a fourth pad and snap two connectors into the side “A” slots. Connect pad #4 to pad #1. Take a fifth pad and snap two connectors into the side “A” slots. Connect pad #5 to pad #4. Lastly connect pad #6 to both pads #3 and #5. Note: The “A” slots
are tighter and will help to keep the connectors in place. It may be necessary to use a hammer or mallet to snapthe connectors into the “A” slots.
Once installation of the pads is complete, lower the spa carefully onto the pads to avoid moving them.
Made in USA by:
Confer Plastics, Inc.
97 Witmer Road
North Tonawanda NY 14120
www.conferladders.com
800-635-3213
Fax 716-694-3102
e-mail: ladders@conferplastics.com
Warranty: The Handi-Spa Pad is warranted by the manufacturer to be free from manufacturing defects for a
period of one (1) year from date of purchase.
Printed in USA Rev 03/04
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jsut curious, what's the difference between "construction" and "play" sand? Why the distinction? I knw nothing about sand, but I thougth "play sand" was cleaner and finer and therefore would compact better, no?
I believe that play sand is very fine, but also very regular, so it compacts, but does not withstand displacement well. Construction sand I'm assuming is like crushed rock, in that it is angular and rough, so once compacted, it resists compression. Imagine walking over a wet playground sand box vs well compacted DG.
I'm extrapolating a bit here from stuff that my engineering brother taught me when I did hardscape in my backyard, but I think it is accurate.
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I didn't want to pour concrete, so I did this:
(http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i20/aegdvm/P1000894.jpg)
That looks sharp! Gives me some ideas for other projects I have.....thanks for sharing the pics!
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Mez and Jack- thank you both!
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Mez and Jack- thank you both!
Anne, you are quite welcome! Thank you for sharing that awesome job! It looks fantastic!