Just back frm Class

[Reese]

You are correct....the list was entirely comprised of features....and not benefits. .but will at a later time attach the benefit to each of the the features listed....this is not a problem.

I don't see what purpose interjecting a bunch of Coleman features, or the benefits associated with them will accomplish here.  Just last week someone tried that with another brand, with the predicitable backlash that resulted in a new thread about hostility.

[drewstar]

I'm still confused about ties wraps and velcro and why he'd mention them, but when asked to provide info just laugh,  


Honetlys,  I'd like to know. I thought it was a legit question. And I'm wondering why a dealer and  vetren poster would mention he got to wet test several competetive brands but not go into any analsys about them frustrates me.  As I think it would be good subject matter.

But I'll take  my meds and realize that my  questions can be construed by some as bashing.

[Mendocino101]

You are correct....the list was entirely comprised of features....and not benefits.  As we sales types know....customers but benefits.  At this moment i am considerably busy....but will at a later time attach the benefit to each of the the features listed....this is not a problem.

I don't typically follow threads so closely...but I sensed a particular inaccuracy in what was being stated regarding the Marquis.  I felt compelled to respond.....anyway off to work....

Please point out the inaccuracy. Exactly where is it? Funny thing that seems to be overlooked or not understood, In order to move water from areas within a spa and to target them to direct body parts you need two things, one jets that are built for that hi flow and two a THREE way valve, other spas only have a two way valve, Marquis patented their three way valve. Now once again you can discuss and debate the merit of this. but to debate if this is true or not is simply a waste of time as this is how it works and is not open for debate, to do so would be much the same way as continuing to debate a V10 Ford motor and Honda Civic 4 cylinder and the Honda person claiming that there engine displacement size is the same, you can talk about many things about them if you want but size is not one of them. As for Marquis and the way they choose to deliver therapy you can argue that others makers do it better or their design is better but to claim the Marquis can not deliver therapy in this way or that others do the same is not true as the tools needed to do so are not there for them. Just one more example: If I said Marquis had a jet that worked just the in very same way as the Moto Massage we all know it would be untrue and to continue to debate it just because I made the claim would be silly.

[loosenupspas]

Bonni, just know this you are not going to get 160 gallons of water per minute that is concentrated to target one body area for deep therapy from anyone other than Marquis. I mean no one else is even close.

i do disagree with you there......many many are close if not exactly the same......

[Mendocino101]

I'm still confused about ties wraps and velcro and why he'd mention them, but when asked to provide info just laugh,  


Honetlys,  I'd like to know. I thought it was a legit question. And I'm wondering why a dealer and  vetren poster would mention he got to wet test several competetive brands but not go into any analsys about them frustrates me.  As I think it would be good subject matter.

But I'll take  my meds and realize that my  questions can be construed by some as bashing.

Drew,

 Do you honestly believe that if I said what I thought about others makers spas in a wet test, it would have much credibility or if I said this is how so and so makes their spas it would not be seen as me bashing? It really just hit me that consumers here have much more freedom to express themselves more openly than we do as dealers as very few would doubt our ability to be objective.

[Mendocino101]

i do disagree with you there......many many are close if not exactly the same......

It very easy to cast doubt and much easier when you just throw out there without ANY point of reference. Please go back and read again. I shared many times and how and why Marquis does this and why its different from others. Others have only said I do not think it’s true but offer NOTHING of substance to dispute it. And once again you can argue its merits but not the way it’s done.

[Bonibelle]

OK...I have an idea . My sister needs a tub and I am trying to get her to buy one. Loosenup you tell me which tub you think will deliver the same therapy as the HK40's in my Epic and my sister and I will go wet test that tub. This will be a realistic and true test because she also loves the therapy of my deep therapy seat...and she would settle for no less. She is in a different market area so there may be more dealers available and we wouldn't be wasting anyone's time...we would be objective and realistic...How's that?

[drewstar]

Drew,

 Do you honestly believe that if I said what I thought about others makers spas in a wet test, it would have much credibility or if I said this is how so and so makes their spas it would not be seen as me bashing? It really just hit me that consumers here have much more freedom to express themselves more openly than we do as dealers as very few would doubt our ability to be objective.

I agree with you that dealers, like it or not have much more responsiblity here. But yes, I think a dealer could post a review of wet tests and be taken as credibale.  However, to do so would require you to point out the benifits and flaws of everyproduct, including the one you represent.   I doubt you (or anyone) would.   But it begs the question then,  why bring it up then at all.  Of all the things to talk about,  you bring up somehting that would get people asking, but can't answer. I would have found something else to post about.

why no discuss the velcor and tie wraps?  That's somehting that might be less subjectivie? And if you can't, once again why bring it up?  Mendo., I have a lot of respect for you, but I find mentioning something and alluding to it without discussing it, is kind of "catty" .  That's all.  

[Mendocino101]

Drew,

Thats fine but remember I was asked a question and I thought provided an answer that was short and not pointed at any maker nor did I even mention what tubs where there. So my answer was to share an example without degrading anothers product.

[loosenupspas]

it was your quote that i took acception to.....it casts doubt.  but i agree that you have a threeway diverter valve and it moves water in new and different ways, at least for marquis.  However, my spas have pumps the work at 160 gpm and can be isolated to four jets and specific parts of the body.  Now by my calculations if you divert water at 160 gpm through 4 jets those jets are accomodating 40 gpm.  I don't believe this is uncommon.  The threeway diverter valve is unique to Marquis, this is fact and true.  I think....as I read into your writing, that the marquis by virtue of this valve and its new jet pillor delivers greater jet strength than a Moto-Massage.  Again since i am intrepreting your writing i could be wrong as rain.  

[loosenupspas]

OK...I have an idea . My sister needs a tub and I am trying to get her to buy one. Loosenup you tell me which tub you think will deliver the same therapy as the HK40's in my Epic and my sister and I will go wet test that tub. This will be a realistic and true test because she also loves the therapy of my deep therapy seat...and she would settle for no less. She is in a different market area so there may be more dealers available and we wouldn't be wasting anyone's time...we would be objective and realistic...How's that?

wet test a 706. 705, M6 or 481

[Bonibelle]

Coleman right?

[Mendocino101]

it was your quote that i took acception to.....it casts doubt.  but i agree that you have a threeway diverter valve and it moves water in new and different ways, at least for marquis.  However, my spas have pumps the work at 160 gpm and can be isolated to four jets and specific parts of the body.  Now by my calculations if you divert water at 160 gpm through 4 jets those jets are accomodating 40 gpm.  I don't believe this is uncommon.  The threeway diverter valve is unique to Marquis, this is fact and true.  I think....as I read into your writing, that the marquis by virtue of this valve and its new jet pillor delivers greater jet strength than a Moto-Massage.  Again since i am intrepreting your writing i could be wrong as rain.  

 I have no clue how you made the relationship between the moto massage and our therapy pillar and thought I was making that comparison but none the less. If am not mistaken you can correct me if I am wrong but the highest jet that Coleman uses has a flow of 16gpm. As are many jets in the industry the Hk40 from Marquis is a patented jet. and also and this is again what makes the Marquis different you can move that 160 gpm from the upper to lower body or move it up and down your legs on some models.

[drewstar]

Drew,

Thats fine but remember I was asked a question and I thought provided an answer that was short and not pointed at any maker nor did I even mention what tubs where there. So my answer was to share an example without degrading anothers product.

We're not going to talk about ties wraps and velcro, are we?      

[Mendocino101]

lol...nope not with me....as again It would not be seen in any good light.....