Outdoor Clock?

[Repeat_Offender]

That is a good question.  My Arctic does not.  I asked my salesman why a $9000 spa would not have a clock, since it has the display.  I think that is something that should be on a spa.

Do other brands have a clock?

Steven-

Yup, mine does. How can you set the filtration programs without one?

[East_TX_Spa]

Some of us don't have to set filtration programs...or timers....or heating cycles....just set the temperature and relaxxxxxxxxxxxx.xxx..x..........become one with the water and the starsssssss.........

Termmmmmm................

[Bonibelle]

Huh? Seriously, how can you set the filtration cycles if you don't have a clock? I guess I am really dumb...I don't get it.
Are there tubs that don't have the option to set the filtration cycles?
I'm not trying to start anything, I am just asking  :-?

[East_TX_Spa]

HotSpring and Tiger River Spas filter continuously 24/7.  There is nothing to program.

All you do is set your temperature......and that's it.  It's always hot, clean, and ready to go.

I'm sure there are some other spas as easy to operate....aren't there?

Term

[drewstar]

This brings up a question..Don't most tubs have a clock? Otherwise how can you set the times of your filtration cycles?..Just wondering

Bonnie the only tubs that have filter cycles are the Thermal syle tubs.   Running the pumps does help clean the water, but the pumps are run primarly to generate heat for the cabinet.

Full foam tubs have a circ pump that continualy moves the water  and the only time the pumps are turned on are when you want them.   Did you not pay attention while we were all beating the poor horse to death? I could have sworn I saw you with a stick in your hand.  

[Reese]

Bonnie the only tubs that have filter cycles are the Thermal syle tubs.   Running the pumps does help clean the water, but the pumps are run primarly to generate heat for the cabinet.

I don't think that is accurate.  First of all, TP tubs don't run the pumps for the purpose of generating heat, they just are constructed to capture the heat that is given off when the pumps are operated.  Second, some FF tubs use jet pumps to filter, not circ pumps.  Finally, I believe some tubs combine both a circ pump and extra jet pump filter cycles.

[drewstar]

I don't think that is accurate.  First of all, TP tubs don't run the pumps for the purpose of generating heat, they just are constructed to capture the heat that is given off when the pumps are operated.  Second, some FF tubs use jet pumps to filter, not circ pumps.  Finally, I believe some tubs combine both a circ pump and extra jet pump filter cycles.

Yes,  FF tubs do use the jet pumps for filtration, during a short clean up cycle. So, yes they are used for filtration, but only for short  widely disperesed times. Not timed cycles.

TP do run the pumps to generate heat. Absolutely. I would guess the electrical usage (runing the heater) would go up significanlty if you took a TP tub in the dead of winter and set the filtration cycles to minimum, if not all the way off.  TP tubs depend on the larger pumps running to insulate. It's not a  ancillary component of the insulation system, but a primary one.  

[Reese]

Yes,  FF tubs do use the jet pumps for filtration, during a short clean up cycle. So, yes they are used for filtration, but only for short  widely disperesed times. Not timed cycles.

TP do run the pumps to generate heat. Absolutely. 

Sorry, but I respectfully (for now ) disagree on both counts.  I believe that some FF tubs run timed filter cycles utilizing 2 speed jet pumps (?Marquis, Sundance?).  I would also be surprised to learn that any of the reputable TP manufacturers state that they run the pumps for the main purpose of generating heat.  I'm pretty sure they view it as a byproduct.

[drewstar]

Sorry, but I think you are wrong on both counts.  I believe that some FF tubs run timed filter cycles utilizing 2 speed jet pumps (?Marquis, Sundance?).  I would also be surprised to learn that any of the reputable TP manufacturers state that they run the pumps for the main purpose of generating heat.  I'm pretty sure they view it as a byproduct.

I can't speak to the timed cycles on all full foam tubs as an absolute definate, so I'll concede that.

But as far as the pumps running to generate heat in a tp tub, I stand by what I said. It's critical to the system.

[Reese]

I can't speak to the timed cycles on all full foam tubs as an absolute definate, so I'll concede that.

But as far as the pumps running to generate heat in a tp tub, I stand by what I said. It's critical to the system.  

Now you're only half wrong.  Can you point me to something that backs up your "run the pumps for heat" claim?  The only tub I've ever seen claim to heat with waste heat is a Softub, where they encase the pump in a jacket to capture the heat.  Is is possible you are confused by the fact that in a tub without a circ pump -- when heat is called for, a jet pump comes on to circulate water past the heater?

[Chas]

 8-)

[Bonibelle]

Drew and Term, My tub does have filter cycles (I have no circ pump).
So I have the ability to set my filtration cycles for the time of day that I want the filtration to occur and the duration of the filtration cycles.  Marquis has the smart clean cycle that automatically begins a filtration cycle ( the duration is also variable)..about 1/2 hour after you soak. So if I knew I was having company, I might bump my clean cycle up to 2 hours...(depending on who the company was)

Getting back to the clock ...I love having a clock in the tub as well as a timer. The timer lets the kids know when they are "well done" and eliminates any arguments about when the tub get turned over to the adults.  

[drewstar]

Now you're only half wrong.  Can you point me to something that backs up your "run the pumps for heat" claim?  The only tub I've ever seen claim to heat with waste heat is a Softub, where they encase the pump in a jacket to capture the heat.  Is is possible you are confused by the fact that in a tub without a circ pump -- when heat is called for, a jet pump comes on to circulate water past the heater?

Reese, drop the circ pump for a moment. Ok?

A Thermal pane tub depends on heat from the pumps to maintain a warm air barrier in the cabinet.  Do you disagree with that?

If you do disagree, please explain to me how you belive a TP tub insulates.

[drewstar]

Dear Reese,
 http://arcticspastl.com/heat%20lock.html

Each Arctic Spa comes with our Perimeter HeatLock Insulation system, designed to minimize heat loss and to maximize energy efficiency. Once the spa shell is placed into the cabinet, high density insulating urethane foam is applied to the floor, cabinet walls, doors and the spa rim underside. This creates a sealed dead air space similar to that found in most houses in the Northern U.S.A. and Canada.Unlike most spas, the equipment, heater and pumps of an Arctic Spa are positioned inside this insulated area.

This maximizes energy efficiency, shields against mechanical noise and protects equipment from freezing. The incidental (waste) heat that all motors and heaters produce is trapped in this sealed air space and naturally transferred through the spa shell, directly heating the spa water. Recovering waste heat from the motors and heaters significantly reduces the overall heating costs of Arctic Spas. Other spas direct this ambient heat outward to the environment.This captured heat within the Perimeter HeatLock system also acts as a secure protection against freezing in sub-zero temperatures. If power to your spa is interrupted, heat from the spa water slowly transfers back into the insulated air space, protecting the plumbing and equipment from freeze-up. Even at 40 degrees below zero, your spa water will stay above freezing for days and your equipment would be protected from freezing.


Sounds like it designed to depend on heat from the motors, no?   In order for that dead air space not to draw heat away from the water and shell, the dead air space must be kept at an equal or greater temperature than the water.  Anything lower will draw the heat from the water.  It's warm air that insualtes the water, not really "Dead" air.
 

[Reese]

Reese, drop the circ pump for a moment. Ok?
A Thermal pane tub depends on heat from the pumps to maintain a warm air barrier in the cabinet.  Do you disagree with that?
If you do disagree, please explain to me how you belive a TP tub insulates.

I did drop the circ pump issue after you conceded, that's how you got to "half-wrong".

I think we agree on how TP insulates.  One distinction is the that Arctic Heatlock system you quoted is not classic thermopane (think Coleman, Master, etc) but a hybrid FF/TP, as the exterior of the cabinet is insulated with a thick sprayed blanket similar to a FF application, with nothing at all on the shell/pipes.  TP usually has a light coating on the shell and styrofoam panels on the cabinet.  The air trapped in between is the "thermopane".  That really doesn't matter, as the point of of disagreement seems to be whether the fact that thermopane/heatlock attempts to capture and utilize waste heat implies that they run the pumps in order to generate heat (your stated contention) or if it is a byproduct of other necessary operations (my position).  IMO attempting to capture incidental (waste) heat in order to reduce heating costs is  different than your initial statement that "pumps are run primarily to generate heat for the cabinet".

I own a FF tub with a circ pump, so I don't have any skin in the TP/jet pump heat issue, I just didn't want to leave your (IMO) inaccurate statements unchallenged.  Although interesting for some of us, FF/TP discussions tend to hijack threads.  We are a long way from outdoor clocks.  My apologies, Northwoods.

p.s.  We mounted a simple metal wall clock from IKEA on the house for our outdoor timekeeping.  It cost less than $20, but doesn't look cheap -- and runs/looks like new a year later.