Artesian Piper Glen vs Sundance Optima

[sledjunkie]

Piper
 
Dry Weight 968 lbs
Filled Weight 5,175 lbs
Water Capacity 505 gl
Number of Pumps 6
Pump Descriptions (5) Switchless 3 hp. pumps
(1) 11 gpm 24 hr. circ. pump
Total Jets 59
92x92x36

Emerald

Dry Weight 786 lbs
Filled Weight 4,950 lbs
Water Capacity 500 gl
Number of Pumps 4
Pump Descriptions (2) 6 hp. (1) 3 hp. (1) 11 gpm 24 hr. circ. pump
Total Jets 40
91x91x36

Optima

Dry Weight: 855 lbs
Filled Weight: 4,858 lbs
Water Capacity (Avg. Fill): 480 US gal
Number of Pumps 3
2 TheraMax high-flow pumps and Dynamic Flow Circulation System
Total Jets: 39
7'5" x 7'5" x 37.5"

[Vinny]

Hey I see diverter valves in the Optima, I don't see any in the Piper.

Based on what Sled posted both the Piper and the Emerald have more pumps and jets. Heck even my Cayman has more jets and pumps and it is WAY below an Optima priice.

Is that an actual picture of the Optima, it looks like it has a lot of little jets. Tiny foot dome jets and you don't even have any ass jets in the Optima!

I think you better rethink your thoughts!!!

And before all you Optima owners get too crazy .... hymbaw started it!

[sledjunkie]

Yes hymbaw made me revert to my negative side..

 

[hymbaw]

I was talking about the mold of the shell(which was obviously copied from Sundance)

BTW - The first sign of a cheap tub is when they start touting "how many" jets instead of "how therapeutic" the jet placement is.
On the Piper they have jets way out wide (kidney beaters I guess),
and "ass jets" - Please, you're embarrassing yourselves.

I do know this.... Artesian approached us about becoming a dealer a couple of years back, even sent us a tub to look over. After our service manager looked it over and shared his opinions with the owner, well lets just say "we went another way".

I've said in the past that Artesian is a "good" tub. My initial reply was in response to Sled's non-stop negative comments about every tub that's not an Artesian. Mission accomplished

[sledjunkie]

Am I missing something?
Could you explain why it's obvious that the mold of the shell on the piper was copied from sundance.
From looking at the pictures, they appear to be very different.

Do I make non-stop negative comments about every tub that isn't artesian? News to me.

[wesj53]

wes -
The piper was not hot. It was for a brand spanking new model.
Why is this so hard to believe?

You guys are paying top dollar.

Maybe. I know I was quoted $10500 with all extras except stereo and I have read many other posters who got a similar price. Wow, if I could have gotten a Piper for $8500 I would have purchased it over my Tundra. That would have been a real buy.

[Stemay]

I have no clue how many jets my Artesian has.  I really don't care.  All I know is that there are enough to target a lot of different muscles groups and they are strong enough to do a thorough job.  The controls are variable enough that I can control how much power I need to accomplish whatever goal it is that I have for the day.  

since we are all different sizes and shapes, the jets hit us all in different places.  None of the jets beat my kidneys.  If they did, I would just turn them off.  There are two jets that hit me a little hard in the lats, so I just have them turned off.

As for the "ass jets"....which ones are you talking about?  The ones on the seat?  Those are actually for the hamstring area.  One must be very careful getting on and off the seat.....well....unless of course, you have different goal in mind.  The hamstrings are a very important muscle group and this seat does excellent work.  I also like sitting in one of the corner seats and putting my legs up to hit my calves.  

The other "ass jets" are on the cool off seat.  These hit the gluteus medius and other hip rotator muscles.  Keeping this area and the hamstrings nice and relaxed can keep lower back pain at bay.

On the Piper Glen, there are plenty of jets placed well enough to be very therapeutic!

[wesj53]

One negative thing I heard about the Artesians is that as the pillows age, they fall off the back fastener (a button I think if I remember correctly) which degrade and then are very difficult to re-attach. Does anyone have an older Artesian (more than a couple years old) who has had that problem?

[Vinny]

The ass jets I was talking about is in the seats and I was goofing about them, my tub has them too!

I thought it was a good idea to have them since I didn't get a lounger and these make that seat a quasi lounger as I have mentioned many times before. I really don't use that seat as a "lounger", but it does work well as a shallow seat.

There were dealers on here, Sundance dealers, that have brought in Artesian and were impressed, so go figure. Although one of the dealers were forced to stop selling Sundance because Sundance pulled the dealership away from them ... it's a shame too as it seems based on what he wrote he was a good dealer.

I think hymbaw needs to calm down as do all of us! This gets much too insulting - their only hot tubs!

[tanstaafl2]

Can't quite figure the notion that the PG shell is a copy of the Optima shell. I own neither of the brands in question and have never seen the PG or Emerald in person although I have seen and wet tested an Optima.

In fact all three tubs (including the Emerald) are somewhat similar in that they are four corner, relatively open seating shells of a similar size with a foot dome. So is the one I have for that matter. Seems like there would be little one could do to make them truly distinct from one another since they are all essentially filling the same role. The Optima is more distinct from the PG it appears to me in that it has it has a very round foot well while the PG is fairly square. And the Emerald is kind of somewhere in between. The PG has the stair step seat that neither the Optima or the Emerald have. Jet configurations are different in all three tubs.

As to the equipment on each tub the Optima does indeed seem more like the Emerald. The PG seems to have a good deal more what with a variable speed pump for every corner seat and IF the quality of the equipment used and the construction itself is fairly similar and the price between the PG and Optima were the same I would certainly lean towards the PG, depending on wet test and personal comfort in the spa of course.

As to the quality of jets, pumps, electronics, etc and general construction I certainly can't say if one is better than another. The Optima might truly be vastly superior in components and construction. Doesn't seem likely but it might. But even if it is a little better I might still lean towards PG because it seems to offer greater flexibility.

[Spatech_tuo]

Can't quite figure the notion that the PG shell is a copy of the Optima shell. I own neither of the brands in question and have never seen the PG or Emerald in person although I have seen and wet tested an Optima.

If you have a non-lounge spa with the filter in the middle of one sides of a 7½ ft square then you'll end up with the type of seating arrancgement you see there. Is one a copy of the other? It all comes down to your definition of "copy". They certainly have a similar signature but I don't think that's about trying to emulate the Optima but rather it's about how many seats you can have for human being for that size spa. It the gemoetry and human anatomy that may make it seem like it replicates the Optima's layout but how else would you have it. The only part they could call a "copy" IMO is the additon of the foot dome and I'm not who tries to lay claim to that feature as their baby.

[Lakedaisy]

Thanks to those who pointed out that you can now get the Platinum Series in Gray.  I called my dealer yesterday and she checked with the factory.  Yes the Gray from the other series is now avaiable on the Platinum.  I was able to modify my order to change the cabinet color to Gray.  Thanks for the help.

[tileman]

I couldn't agree with hymbaw more about how many jets a tub has. All those tubs with 500 jets (exageration) half of them are the size of dimes and feel like you're getting pissed on. For all new shoppers, if a dealer makes a big deal about their 500 jets just politely say no thanks and walk away.

[Vinny]

I couldn't agree with hymbaw more about how many jets a tub has. All those tubs with 500 jets (exageration) half of them are the size of dimes and feel like you're getting pissed on. For all new shoppers, if a dealer makes a big deal about their 500 jets just politely say no thanks and walk away.

But I see more small jets in an Optima than the Piper, Emerald or my tub ... what are those little round things on the base of the seats or in the foot well?

[tileman]

I wasn't comparing, just generalizing. But I'll take a look at who has the most useless jets now and get back.