New U.L. Approval Standards

[Micah]

"Effective April 1st. 2006 new regulations issued by the Underwriters Laboratory (UL Code 1563, Section 39.11) forbid the conection of any auxillary components conected by wire outside of spas."
"They go on to say that the use of any portable radio including but not limited to i-pods and mp3 players is an electrical hazard and is UNSAFE"
Does this mean that any company that uses a portable device as their stereo would loose their U.L. approval and could infact be producing an unsafe product?

[TN__HOT_TUB]

i think the important distinction is:    "connected by wire OUTSIDE of spas"

Aren't the stereos built in?  

I'm no electrician.  One way to know for sure is to wait and see how the hot dealers react (if they remove all radios, then i think we've found our answer)

[MarKee]

There are only 2 or 3 companies fully UL approved out there...some have components registered but not the whole spa.

[Micah]

i think the important distinction is:    "connected by wire OUTSIDE of spas"

Aren't the stereos built in?  

I'm no electrician.  One way to know for sure is to wait and see how the hot dealers react (if they remove all radios, then i think we've found our answer)

Most stereos are built in but some companies are trying to forego the stereo and just use an i-pod that plugs into the spa speakers.  I think the stereos are legal its the Aux A/V plugs that seem like it might be unsafe

[Chas]

Does this mean that any company that uses a portable device as their stereo would loose their U.L. approval and could infact be producing an unsafe product?

Why are you asking this question?

[Vinny]

I guess this is for the people who would hook up a electrical source to the mini stereo plug... maybe they deserve to fry!

When I looked at HS, they had a CD player that you hooked up via a mini stereo cable - this wouldn't pass the UL standards.

Of course those of you who would hook up that MP3 player to a 12 volt marine battery could get a little tingly IF you got over zealous with the water flowing out of the tub ...

[oldersparepairguy]

In my opinion.........calling the audio cable running  from an Ipod to the spa audio input jack an "unsafe wire" is a stretch. The voltages present on this type of wire is measured in millivolts, and only a few at that. One millivolt equals .001 volts, or 1 x 10 to the -3 power for those of you who prefer scientific notation. My point is, I could safely place the stereo audio cable from an Ipod in my mouth, with no negative effect, other than looking ridiculoous. I am sure some salespeople will start using this UL "info" to slam a competitors spa. I can here it now, " brand x spas are not safe like ours, they let you plug an Ipod with a thin little wire, and Underwear Laxatives tells us that can kill you! So buy our Supersafe wireless spa"

[Micah]

In my opinion.........calling the audio cable running  from an Ipod to the spa audio input jack an "unsafe wire" is a stretch. The voltages present on this type of wire is measured in millivolts, and only a few at that. One millivolt equals .001 volts, or 1 x 10 to the -3 power for those of you who prefer scientific notation. My point is, I could safely place the stereo audio cable from an Ipod in my mouth, with no negative effect, other than looking ridiculoous. I am sure some salespeople will start using this UL "info" to slam a competitors spa. I can here it now, " brand x spas are not safe like ours, they let you plug an Ipod with a thin little wire, and Underwear Laxatives tells us that can kill you! So buy our Supersafe wireless spa"

I just spoke with an electrican of 20 years who seemed to disagree with you.  Not that the milivolts could hurt anyone, but that any form of "outside electrical input could render a G.F.C.I. useless. He explained how that input could cause a G.F.C.I. to pop premature or to remain on after it should have poped.
Any sales man can down play this issue or blow it out of praportion (Depending on what side of the fence they wish to reside) The fact remains that a respected agency says this isnt safe and some "old spa guy" knows better than U.L.  I'll stick with U.L.

[MarKee]

Marquis and Master Spas are the only spas I know that have entire models listed by UL.  Are there any others?

[Cola]

Back to the top Micah.  Would you mind quoting exactly from the new UL standard.  Electrical code is all about interpretation - from qualified individuals.  I can see this hitting a few pages by days end here.  I won't even bother to comment further until I have a chance to better understand the new standard.
Steve

[Chas]

Marquis and Master Spas are the only spas I know that have entire models listed by UL.  Are there any others?

HotSpring tubs, in fact almost all Watkins products, are ETL listed to the UL standard. So they are tested and certified to the exact same standard as a tub certified by UL.

Many other tub makers have jumped to ETL in recent years, the same standard is used on those makers as well.

ETL is the older of the two major testing labs, having been founded by Thomas A. Edison.

And another note: The new Spaudio II from HotSpring doesn't have the RCA plugs anymore. You can connect inside the cabinet if you are techie, but most folks will use the FM transmitter on an Ipod or similar for a wireless link.