Does well water matter?

[DaisyBug08016]

Okay -

We are having trouble with our chemicals. We have a HS Grandee delivered 2/28. They gave us "Brilliance" chemicals for start up and some fairly comprehensive instructions. Dh is a "mad scientist" and is *usually* (like with fish tanks and stuff) very good at all this water chemistry stuff.

He says that by the end of the week the chlorine is gone... Also our pH is through the roof. Now, we add 2 TBS oxidizer *OR* 1 TBS Chlorine ten minutes before we get into the spa  and run the pumps for ten minutes.

I have read so many things on this site - I get it that no one can agree... What I would really like to know is:

Does anyone here have a HS tub and well water with successful water chemistry? If so what do you use/what is your regimine? What about ANY HS tub owners with successful water chemistry? HS Dealers - what advice do you give?

Oh - BTW - 2 of us use the tub for about a half an hour every night. So far - no other users.

Thank you so much for any advice you can offer!

[Tatooed_Lady]

I thought it was in the teaspoon range after soaking  and Tablespoons of dichlor/MPS to shock....that's the joy of chlorine instead of bromine....add chemicals after you exit, then by the next soak it's down to almost no chemical level....
I don't think tub brand will make a difference....just the gallons, and Grandee is 500.....
This is my input after reading FAR too many posts, and hoping that I haven't mixed things up in my head....

[SurgTec]

I'm still pretty new at this hot tub chemistry myself (almost my third month now) but I can share what I learned in my first month!

Testing too often just makes you paranoid and leads to putting far too many and far too great a quantity of chemicals in your water!

I use an in-line bromine system (spa frog) - but same principals apply - too much, too often leads to cloudy water, skin irritation, and wildly out of balance Alkalinity, pH, etc...  

The only issue well water should bring into the equation is how hard the water is and what contaminants are in it.  Not being an expert - I offer this advice as an honest effort to help - get yourself a 'fill filter' to remove contaminants.  Use a reliable test for water hardness and adjust before adding anything else.  Heat the water to 'normal' temperature - then test and adjust: alkalinity, pH, and sanitizer - in that order.  Don't retest or add additional chemicals sooner than 24 hours.

If more experienced / expert folks respond - I'll take their advice as well!

[galen]

Fill with half soft and half hard if you can. Surg has given good advice.  With well water your going to have a high ph. I use muric acid. If i add, its never more than a teaspoon at a time.

[Brewman]

Brilliance is a brand of Bromine- which contains no chlorine- that's their claim to fame.  
When you say chlorine are you referring to the Brilliance Sanitizer (which is actually bromine), or are you adding dichlor for some reason, say for shock?
Or are you using Brilliance shock, which I belive is MPS?

So when you say chlorine, what are you adding?


To correctly start a bromine based spa, usually you add a packet or two of Sodium Bromide, this give you an instant bromine level.  But then you add Brilliance sanitizer to a floater and place that in the spa.
Until you get your Ph and alk in specs, it may be hard to get a decent reading on your brominel level.  

When you say your chlorine is gone, do you mean the sanitizer isn't reading on a test strip, or do you mean you floater is actually empty?  If it's the floater, what do you have it set for?  Ours is set to about 3, and usually takes at least 2 weeks for the Brillinace to dissolve to where we have to refill the floater.  

Also, what is the hardness reading on your water?  Not sure how much water hardness effects you chemistry, our water is pretty spot on with regard to that.  

Bromine can be tricky to get down pat for some people.
Others seem to have no problems with it.  

I'm using Brilliance, but am switching to dichlor on my next water change, as soon as it warms up into the 50's.  

[jsimo7]

Daisy I use well water and dichlor so I may not help but my procedure is fill 1/2 - 2/3 hard water and finish filling with soft then take a sample to the dealer for test, add calicum hardness to get that correct. The dealer will also tell me how much ph and alk adjustment is needed. do a dichlor shock and that is all after a fill. I'm lucky and have real good well water and dont need any metal gone or anything like that. When using we add 1 teaspoon per person after a soak and a dichlor shock every 10-14 days depending on use. We use it about 3-4 days per week 2 people for 20-30min. Every 3rd or 4th shock I will shock with mps. I have to add a little  ph and alk increase every 3-4 weeks because my ph drops a little bit. Thats it for me, and I've have had good luck so far  1 year ownership. If we dont use it for 2- 3 or more days I will add 1 1/2 tsp of dichlor every other day. I have a Envoy 450 gal and ozone if that makes any difference. My water will last about 5 months before a change so I have only changed it 2 times so far and will change in about a month when the weather warms up.  I check the water 1-2 times per week with test strips. Good luck

[DaisyBug08016]

Thanks so much! Now - you said something interesting... about part hard part soft water... They were VERY specific when they installed the tub - to turn off the water softener. But you do part and part... why can't someone come up with a definitive guide!?!  It IS science afterall - shouldn't it be a less subjective process?? Makes me nutty! LOL...

I am glad to know you use dichlor. I want dh to find that and try it...

Thanks again!

[Steve]

Fill with half soft and half hard if you can. Surg has given good advice.  With well water your going to have a high ph. I use muric acid. If i add, its never more than a teaspoon at a time.

I disagree with almost all of this. Half soft, half hard? What are readings of each?? Watercare isn't about guessing. Regardless of the spa, water is water and yes, well water is a bit tougher to deal with but it's possible to have decent water.

NEVER USE MURIATIC ACID TO ADJUST pH!!!! For people with well water, it's great at lowering Alkalinity when very high but a granular adjustment is required after that of the pH. Quantities will depend on the initial reading. Goog GAWD!

Like the rest of us, these should be the readings you are trying to achieve.

Bromine - 3 - 5ppm
Alk - 80 - 120ppm
Cal Hardness - 150-250ppm
pH - 7.2 - 7.8

Well water characteristically has high TDS (total dissolved solids) which generally require more frequent draining of the spa. I wouldn't take it any higher than 2000ppm.

Steve

[jsimo7]

Thanks so much! Now - you said something interesting... about part hard part soft water... They were VERY specific when they installed the tub - to turn off the water softener. But you do part and part... why can't someone come up with a definitive guide!?!  It IS science afterall - shouldn't it be a less subjective process?? Makes me nutty! LOL...

I am glad to know you use dichlor. I want dh to find that and try it...

Thanks again!

Try taking  a sample of your well water to your dealer to check  and have them tell you what they recomend. Try to get a sample of both softened and non softened for them to test

[Pathfinder]

Steve is bang on about Muratic acid  its mainly to lower levels in Pools    Take both samples in to get tested  and make sure they do an accurate Calcium test on both samples   use the water with the lower hardness reading   its easier to bring up levels than trying to lower  them    Once your hardness levels are over 300 you will never get them back down with any mineral remover.   When trying to lower anything you end up adding to your TDS levels  which will in turn make your sanitizer less effective  and you will start using more of everything and your hot tub wont be fun anymore.    

You could also bring a sample into another dealer just to compare  each test to make sure you have the best reading

IMO  TDS shouldn t go over 1500ppm unless your using a sodium bromide program

[loneoak]

We are also on a well and are constantly fighting high ph.  The dealer suggested using half hard and half soft water.  That's what we do.  Water testing at the dealer's shows the hardness level to be perfect.  Mind you, our well water is very hard.

I add a product called ph minus quite often.

Astrid.

[Tatooed_Lady]

Take both samples in to get tested  and make sure they do an accurate Calcium test on both samples   use the water with the lower hardness reading   its easier to bring up levels than trying to lower  them    Once your hardness levels are over 300 you will never get them back down with any mineral remover.  

Hmm...is the calcium hardness level the same (or only) hardness level checked? Reason I ask is I picked up some of those free little test strips awhile back from the water softener display at Wal Mart....when I checked the unsoftened stuff here, it immediately shot off the readable scale.  The softened water, however...was toward the low/middle end of the scale.
I DO realize that the salts in the softener add to the TDS...but in a case like mine, could it be worth seriously considering mixing hard/soft water?