Author Topic: Rantings of an old tired spa warrior.... (Read 12671 times)

stuart · « **on:** March 05, 2006, 08:54:22 pm »

I sit here and try to read many of these posts without bias or contempt but between the direction the industry has gone over the last year or so and the constant swing of product based off of new customer input I'm really wearing down...

So here is my ranting

1. If you buy a spa over internet you an extreme risk taker. If you recommend someone else buy over the internet your not trustworthy if they take your advice they're a fool and, if you sell spas over the internet you could be a predator.

2. Justify whatever you want in insulation but if my builder tells me that he is going to take 40% of the insulation from around my hot water pipes and "use the dead air space to capture heat" he's fired! Likewise if he suggests that it will be easier to fix leaks I will have to question the ability of his plumber.

3. Good wood cabinets are not a stupid investment...Rails and ledges that can collect dirt and moisture are.

4. Three things matter at the end of the day; Hot clean water, Comfortable Seating and good jets.
If you spend more than 1/4 of your time pitching frame, shell, insulation or warranty you probably lack in one of the these three things and are trying to cover.

5. In 20 years CalSpa pissed off as many people as they made happy if not more.

6. In 20 years HotSpring has had similar problems to everyone else but satisfied more customers than the average to keep a good name.

7. Over half of what HotSpring sells now as innovative features they crusaded against 10 years ago.

8. I don't give a crap where your spa is made....I care how it is made. If you use the location of your factory as a reason for how well your spa holds heat you're a fraud and deceptive to your customers.

9. As a customer I don't care how many people can stand on my cover I care how well it holds heat.

10. Do you know how many jets is enough? After almost 17 years I'm not sure I do.....

11. Should a customer really care what frame size a pump is, what the HP is or whether or not is switchless? Isn't the bottom line how well it moves water and the cost of operation?

12. I don't care if you make a heater out of plutonium that lasts 8 to 10 years if the cost of replacement is more than the benefit�stop making it!

13. At what point does the opinion of a person that bought their first spa outweigh years of experience of a professional that has lived the experience for many years? So many myopic, one-sided opinions meant to encourage someone else to follow the same path that you did will be embarrassing years from now when you both have product fail the same way.

14. If more than 10 people from more than 5 different regions of the country have the same complaint about how a product is built, sold or serviced there is probably some truth to it and the root is probably at the manufacture level (that being the common denominator). If you ignore this and buy from that manufacture you will some day, at some level regret it. Don�t try and justify your decision or hide your doubt by becoming a crusader for the brand!

15. 90% of all water quality issues are due to customers�..if you have a problem with your water, CHANGE IT!

16. Unless you put a meter that tests Kilowatt usage directly between the house and the spa you have no idea of how much energy your spa uses. Don�t just assume because you bought a spa and your power bill went up that your spa is using too much energy! Power bills all over the country are astronomical right now.
A spa uses electricity, the more you use that spa - the more electricity it uses. If you can't sleep because your worried about this don�t buy a spa�

17. If you buy a spa from a show or fair from a company that you have never heard of and cannot remember ever seeing a store for only to find that they are less then reputable don�t tell me they �ripped you off�. You gave them that ability.

18. Any factory that consistently sells to someone without a business plan, credit, a brick and mortar store or equity in the community should be boycotted out of the industry.

19. A chemical or accessory company that empowers a virtual entity to undersell a brick and mortar company with live help and customer service should be boycotted.

20. Don�t think that your spa experience is similar to anyone that isn�t you for any reason�.

Hot Tub Forum · « **on:** March 05, 2006, 08:54:22 pm »

salesdvl · « **Reply #1 on:** March 05, 2006, 09:33:28 pm »

Wow.

I like it.

hottubdan · « **Reply #2 on:** March 05, 2006, 09:33:56 pm »

Brookenstein · « **Reply #3 on:** March 05, 2006, 09:34:55 pm »

Don't mean to scare you Stuart, but I'm a useless newbie owner and I agree with what you said.

Nice rant.

HotTubMan · « **Reply #4 on:** March 05, 2006, 09:45:53 pm »

Stuart, I liked you when I found this site.

I liked you when we started to correcspond.

I disliked you when your attempt to help me got me in hot water.

I liked you when we met.

I love you for your post. Nice.

bosco0633 · « **Reply #5 on:** March 05, 2006, 09:48:47 pm »

hey stu, good points, however, what is the point of this forum then. Its a place to question, vent, compare and enjoy trials and tribulations.

I agree with you, things get blown out of proportion here and people including myself frustrate the hell out of people in the buisness, but lets face it, this forum is a source of information and an outlet to keep your buisness going, so I guess a necessary evil.

Chas · « **Reply #6 on:** March 05, 2006, 09:52:48 pm »

Yeah, but other than that...

OH! Almost forgot - #15 is wrong. It's 99.99999%

Plus a little.

J._McD · « **Reply #7 on:** March 05, 2006, 09:59:08 pm »

True-er words could never be spoken.

AMEN & Alleluia

and in terminators case, pass the ammunition.

What make people think they can come in and offer you less than what is fair, and want the extras free?

What makes some sellers think they can unfairly take advantage of honest people and deliver less than they should?

What make honest people think they can make it in this business? But still they try. They are the ones that have struggled to be here 20 years later, when the fast buck artist is here and gone in 5.

Why do people not trust or believe other honest people when they did 30 years ago?

Why is it so hard for people to see the truth, is it because they are blinded by the fast talking wheeler and dealer, or is it because they are not honest themselves and don't believe others could possibly be honest?

Why is it our fault, when they make a bad choice buying off the internet, the warehouse or the big box store, or because there is a $5,000 rebate and need our help to fix their problems?

Why is it our problem when they get sucked in to a great deal and everything goes wrong for the next 6 months?

Why do we struggle so to stay in this business to be thought of so poorly of?

If shoppers could only recognize those of us who are honest and willing to be fair. To be able to recognize we are willing to sell and and deliver quality goods and provide everything the consumers could expect that will last a 15 years and more, IF only they could, everyone would be soaking in Hot Water tonight, enjoying life and their family to the utmost, sleeping better and have a much better outlook on life.

IF ONLY.

HotTubMan · « **Reply #8 on:** March 05, 2006, 10:01:30 pm »

Boscoe, I dont think he was criticizing the forum, just expressing frustration regarding:
1) problems that come up repeatedly, despite the wealth of knowledge here
2) Unsubstantiated claims by manufacturer agents and sales people, customers and newbies (like me)

hymbaw · « **Reply #9 on:** March 05, 2006, 10:46:08 pm »

Well said Stuart!!!

jim97219 · « **Reply #10 on:** March 05, 2006, 11:00:39 pm »

That really sums it up well, Stuart. The only thing I'd change is line one. I think I'd have it read "If you buy a spa over internet or from a big box store[/b], you are an extreme risk taker. If you recommend someone else buy over the internet or from a big box store[/b], you're not trustworthy. If they take your advice, they're a fool, and if you sell spas over the internet, you could be a predator.

I also took the liberty of a little grammar clean-up. I hope you don't mind.

Jim

NJDave · « **Reply #11 on:** March 05, 2006, 11:06:34 pm »

Great Job Stuart! Good Stuff. Thanks, for taking the time. I enjoyed all twenty points. Dave.

stuart · « **Reply #12 on:** March 05, 2006, 11:14:25 pm »

If I may add....

21. When I take a spa in on trade I charge myself $150 per hour for 2 men, spa dolly, truck, equipment, insurance, lost straps, phones, ect...

When we get it back we put in new seals, replace pillows, jets and usually a heater. Add to that 800 gallons of water for first and second leak test plus the cost of power and labor to make sure it works and stain it (and the stain). Next we put in a set of new filters, new cover and chemical kit.

If you think you can get a better deal from your neighbors cousin that is selling his spa because of divorce then go for it!

If you think I should give you $2000 for your trade that will cost me $1500 to get to the point that I'm comfortable with resell how about you see if Home Depot will take it in trade.

22. People typically break out in a hot tub rash after they have had a party with the neighbor�s kids over and did not add enough sanitizer. This is not a reflection of your spa or your dealer, ask for help...don't blame.

23. Your dealer has a life also that includes Christmas, Easter, Mothers Day and other holidays. They to have families, homes and all the other pressures of life. If they are not jumping through hoops for you at the moment it could be that they're dealing with their problems not ignoring yours. Have compassion on both ends.

24. Cars are essential, furniture is justifiable...spas are a luxury indulgence in most folks minds. When the spa breaks their inner psychosis says "I knew I shouldn't have wasted my savings on this!". If you can't understand this as a dealer and have some grace then change professions!

25. I pay $30K per month to keep my store open....in order to do this I need to make a profit. This means that every hour of wage I pay I need to earn money to offset. We are a facilitator of a warranty...this means that every time a tech comes to your house for a service call its billed to someone, either the factory or the customer. This means if your spa is not running and you don't check the GFI breaker before we come out we will bill you! It's only business.

J._McD · « **Reply #13 on:** March 06, 2006, 09:11:36 am »

Stuart, you have summed it up in understanding terms. Well said. Consumers and shoppers deal with only one Hot Tub experience, theirs. The dealers, well, it is presumed he is in it for the gross profits that are imagined to be greater than they are. What you and other dealers deliver to the end user is far greater than what the internet or the big bos delivers, BUT their price is cheaper, go figure.

But then they still come in to whine.

Steve · « **Reply #14 on:** March 06, 2006, 11:19:36 am »

Well my friend, you done good!

I've got one more to add...

If you pitch your spa as the "BEST" of anything, you better have the data to back that broad statement up that shows a detailed cross reference with EVERY other spa manufacturer!

If I could change one word in the english language, it would be "BEST".

Chin up my friend! Keep in mind that you represent the top 5% of dealers worldwide in knowledge, experience and how to run a spa business!

Steve

Hot Tub Forum · « **Reply #14 on:** March 06, 2006, 11:19:36 am »

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