The Great Pool and Spa Show

[windsurfdog]

From a marketing standpoint only, I think it is a pretty savvy idea.  Most consumers are under the assumption that all spas are "jacuzzis" anyway and one's as good as another.  Many consumers are also under the impression that they will get a better deal at an off-site event than in the store.  This combination of traits is, I believe, prevalent in the majority of people looking to buy a spa.  This is who they are targeting.

More power to them if it helps them sell spas.  You can't make someone buy something they don't want.  Obviously, these customers are looking to buy and Master Spa is finding a way to sell it to them.  Time will tell whether the consumers are happy with their purchase.

I am not a high pressure salesperson.  I could never do what it sounds like these guys and some other spa manufacturers do to sell their products.  I could never engage in half-truths and exagerrations in order to force someone's hand in buying my spa (I am a consumer as well and absolutely loathe dealing with a slick talking car salesman type).

I'm extremely grateful that I represent a company who has made it to the top of the industry by selling the product on such things as quality, service, performance, enjoyment, and support after the sale.  I can walk down the streets where I work and live and not have to turn the other way because I see a disgruntled customer coming my way.  I make customers for life.  Those are the one's I want.

Terminator

A voice of reason from a dealer rises to the top....thank you, TX....it's easy to see why you have been successful in the industry for over 20 years.  Concentrating on one's own philosophy without "stooping" to the level of the competition is indeed a wise practice.

[mowgli1]

It's a lot easier to be in business that long when you represent a company that has integrity, business scruples, and loyalty to their dealers.

[windsurfdog]

It's a lot easier to be in business that long when you represent a company that has integrity, business scruples, and loyalty to their dealers.

I would agree though I bet the other dealers who are hot under the collar about this are represented by companies that have integrity, business scruples, and loyalty to their dealers as well.....the difference is TX's attitude.....certainly worth emulating.....

[Mendocino101]

Windsurfdog,

Please help me to understand the attitude we should emulate. By calling out and asking a question of consumers do you buy into this type of marketing . I fully respect and appreciate Ex Tex professionalism, He may not have to deal with these types of shows 3 and 4 times a year so maybe he has had less hands on experiences with them. But it seems to come down those who some how want to justify the way they do business . Again if that works for those who do great. But to deceive and lie should never be confused with being savvy and cleaver.

[Spatech_tuo]

I'm more with you Mendo on this one. Master dealers may not be responsible for this but Master Central is and if people have a lesser degree of respect for them because of it it's warranted IMHO. If they'll condone such practices at the corporate level for these "Spa shows" for the sake of a sale then I have to wonder about other decisions they MAY make at times relative to quality, schedule promises, etc. The sale may be the most important thing to all dealers and manufacturers but they all have to also factor in customer needs, their reputation, etc. and they all use a different formulas when considering such things. Cal Spas is the example of a company that has a reputation for putting the customer second. I think Master has to be careful that such practices don't send them reputation in that direction. By the way, this is just my opinion (but I'm sticking to it).

[J._McD]

If we are talking about marketing kudo's, hands down they are the best at what they do.  

Most other manufacturers who have promoted marketing efforts they most commonly do it in the interest of the dealership network building exposure to their name brand and follow it up with glowing customer service.

If the truth be known, I'm not mad or angry about this, because I can't do a darn thing about it.  Fact is, that means I am either jealous or I am complaining, and I am not complaining.

So I guess that makes me jealous.  Do you have any idea how profitable this could be?

These guys spend more on advertising in one weekend then I am able to afford to spend over a years time.  

They buy the product at a lower cost than the dealers pay, they have no overhead other than travel expenses, they support no service network, they sub out the deliveries, they only pay commissions on sales, They don't pay rent, insurance, workman's comp, employee benefits, utilities, and they reward the salesperson for "over par" pricing to get as many $$ they can, and they leave town on Monday.

Sure, they have to plan and strategize,  rent temporary sites, pay for the advertising, arrange transportation and make the bank deposits and never look back or deal with the unhappy or disappointed customers.

They just make hay while the sun shines.  What's wrong with that, eh?  There giving the consumers what they want, aren't they?

[Mendocino101]

J_Mcd,


Now Now.....its not all like that ......I mean when you blow into a town for a only a few days at a time you don't know the better restaurants .... You may not know the quickest way to get to the bank ..... The salesman who are over par are going to grind you for a bigger piece of the pie and than you are going have to keep hearing  the words...." Home Run" or "Boy did I rip their heads Off" ....

[Gary1911]

From a marketing standpoint only, I think it is a pretty savvy idea.  Most consumers are under the assumption that all spas are "jacuzzis" anyway and one's as good as another.  Many consumers are also under the impression that they will get a better deal at an off-site event than in the store.  This combination of traits is, I believe, prevalent in the majority of people looking to buy a spa.  This is who they are targeting.

More power to them if it helps them sell spas.  You can't make someone buy something they don't want.  Obviously, these customers are looking to buy and Master Spa is finding a way to sell it to them.  Time will tell whether the consumers are happy with their purchase.

I am not a high pressure salesperson.  I could never do what it sounds like these guys and some other spa manufacturers do to sell their products.  I could never engage in half-truths and exagerrations in order to force someone's hand in buying my spa (I am a consumer as well and absolutely loathe dealing with a slick talking car salesman type).

I'm extremely grateful that I represent a company who has made it to the top of the industry by selling the product on such things as quality, service, performance, enjoyment, and support after the sale.  I can walk down the streets where I work and live and not have to turn the other way because I see a disgruntled customer coming my way.  I make customers for life.  Those are the one's I want.

Terminator

Great post Chris!! Bravo!  Gary

[windsurfdog]

Windsurfdog,

Please help me to understand the attitude we should emulate. By calling out and asking a question of consumers do you buy into this type of marketing . I fully respect and appreciate Ex Tex professionalism, He may not have to deal with these types of shows 3 and 4 times a year so maybe he has had less hands on experiences with them. But it seems to come down those who some how want to justify the way they do business . Again if that works for those who do great. But to deceive and lie should never be confused with being savvy and cleaver.

Once again, please read the my first post on this subject to understand how I feel about this.

It's pretty easy to sit on a bulletin board or chat room and talk about "deceive and lie".....if you're so worked up about it, call up corporate MS and call them liars and deceivers.....do something about it.....take your "proof" and call their hand.

I don't buy into this "....makes the industry look bad...." BS either....They don't make the industry look any worse than the local Sundance dealer I desperately tried to buy a Cameo from or Sundance corporate who will not let dealers other than the closest to me give me a quote much less sell me a tub.  The local Sundance dealer could only spew about how inferior Hot Springs was compared to Sundance and how the advertising that Rec Warehouse, the local Hot Springs dealer, was so deceptive (sound familiar?).  This didn't do anything but lose a solid sale for him and leave me with my current attitude toward him.....it didn't drag the entire industry down with him, in my opinion.  And MasterSpas benefitted from the fallout.......

And why do you "have to deal with these types of shows 3 and 4 times a year"?  You don't have to deal with these shows AT ALL....you don't have to go to'em, to work at'em, to service the tubs sold after they're gone.....WHAT IS THE BIG FREAKING DEAL?  Let them slice their own throats if they wish....you'll reap the benefits of the fallout.....that is, if there really is any.  Once again, I suggest you fuggetaboutit.....go have a beer and a soak and fuggetaboutit.......

And tuo said:

If they'll condone such practices at the corporate level for these "Spa shows" for the sake of a sale then I have to wonder about other decisions they MAY make at times relative to quality, schedule promises, etc.

So now we go back to this old, worn out coorelation between marketing and tub quality......face it.....comments like that MAY be submitted to influence the casual reader here.  Is this any less deceptive or any more truthful than what you MAY be complaining about?

[J._McD]

Windsurf,

First, let's be friendly and I do not mean to offend you in any way.  We all respect the input of each other.  You seem to be somewhat sensitive about this subject, but then so are we, but in a different way.  

If you will for a moment, take a deep breath, relax and try to understand our prespective,

#1
"It's pretty easy to sit on a bulletin board or chat room and talk about "deceive and lie".....if you're so worked up about it, call up corporate MS and call them liars and deceivers.....do something about it.....take your "proof" and call their hand."

I did exactly what you suggested, each and every word, I took action and I supported everything I said with factual proof.  I found myself, an individual person, inundated with legal intimidation and harassment.  I did in fact have an impact on their advertising materials, their advertisers and the way they do business and I paid my attorney to sit beside me for conferences intended to SHUT ME UP, cease and desist.   They can afford to do this battle better than I.  I am simply a thorn in their side and I have been removed from their christmas card list.

Well there was nothing that could be done because what was said was both factual and truthful, but why should I have to pay my attorney for this legal intimidation and for whose benefit, the truth? other dealers, the consumers??? I did what I did because some of what they do is WRONG.

Later, the EPA had their way with them over issues that were raised, but that took 2 years.

My shopping market is and has been affected for more than 4 years and nobody in the industry likes what they say or do.  

#2
"I don't buy into this "....makes the industry look bad...." BS either....They don't make the industry look any worse than the local Sundance dealer "

You are a single consumer and you are offended by your preception of how you were treated by a single dealer.  I am a dealer and I have been affected by this issue every week for more than 4 years.  It is not the loss of business that is the issue, it is the "attitude" of the consumer who also has been offended and this flows over into our industry, as one negative impression is always remembered and repeatedly mentioned, such as your experience.  Positive issues do not have the same result or impact.

#3
Chances are good that could have been me, or a hundred other dealers, on a given day to have to deal with the loss of a sale from someone who bought because they believed the lies, the misleading deception, the radio "personality" who endorses them, and the $10,000 rebate they would be getting back in 3 years.  Go through this a multiple of times as consumers come in to shop your product only to confirm they made a good decision on the deal they got at a show.  It is called buyer's remorse and due dilligence or lack thereof.

And, this unfortunate event, as you can see, would loose me a sale and have you repeatedly telling everyone how negative I was and how that reflects on the manufacturer that I represent.

#4
".....WHAT IS THE BIG FREAKING DEAL?  Let them slice their own throats if they wish....you'll reap the benefits of the fallout....."

To some of us who depend on this industry for our livelyhood, it is a big deal.  For the occassional shopper or single time buyer, I do understand you prespective and point of view.  

As for your thought, they may well do just that, but how long must we wait and can we hold out for nature to take it's course? I guess that too is our problem not yours.

Please do not be offended by my point of view, I live it every day and must deal with both the good and the bad as we have for 21 years.  We try our best to focus on our customers only.  It is when these orphans call around looking for help that we are reminded, they bought from someone else who is NOT taking care of them, and the stories they tell are not good.

A question for you, please respond, MS displays a banner commerating their 25th anniversay.  Do you know when they opened their business? Can anyone answer that question?

[East_TX_Spa]

He may not have to deal with these types of shows 3 and 4 times a year so maybe he has had less hands on experiences with them.

You are right Mendocino, I haven't had to deal with this type of promotion where I am.  Probably the closest thing I can compare it to are some of the "factory direct" (not to be confused with Factory Direct Spas of Canada, a reputable retail dealer of fine brand name spas) guys that set up on the side of the road and offer "factory direct pricing."  It sounds like the spa show you are dealing with is a very high level production and I can see where it would be very aggravating to deal with.  I sympathize with your plight.

The impulse buy consumers I mostly encounter will purchase a spa at the State Fair of Texas in Dallas, a 2 hour drive from here.  They come to my store to buy chemicals and ask about water care procedures.  I try to help them where I can.  The nut-cutting time occurs when they start having mechanical problems and realize no one is there to service their spa.  They then come to the realization that maybe they should trade in their problem spa (we give them $400 credit on a spa that is 2 years old, less for anything older) on a spa with local dealer support.  We take the approach that if we don't get them the first time around, we will have another opportunity within 4-5 years.  That's about all we can hope for.

Terminator

[obi wan]

this is kind of caveat emptor at its best.
I'm no dealer but i can understand the frustration. unfortunately there will always be people who think they can get a better deal at a show, or on the side of the road, etc....
here in va beach we have truck loads of "real" north carolina furniture that are often set out on closed gas station corners that are a "factory direct specials", today and tomorrow only. there is a company that sells artwork the same way.....  
out of curiosity, does any one know, have any of the masters dealers complained to corp? i totally agree that my general opinion of the comp as a whole goes down, when they use these kind of tactics, but i would think that a masters dealer would have the most to complain about if one of these shows was set up in his area.

[buckeyespa]

TX is right, the shows are expensive. I used to be in the spa business and had looked into this, but theres no way we could have afforded it.  Most of these shows go into vacant bldgs and rent for the weekend. Avg rent we were finding was 3500-5000.00 a weekend, that doesnt include electric. Water is usually turned off, so you have to have water trucked in for your running displays. Then theres clean up costs. Then you have to figure what it costs you to bring in spas, pools, gazebos, etc. Then theres the set up staff hourly wage, and if the show is out of town theres hotel costs as well.

So figure another 2k on top of the 5k already. So now bring in the spas, sometimes mfg's will float the spas other times they want payment. Whats a truck load of spas cost, say 20-30k?

Now lets put the ads on tv, radio, and newspaper, another 10k.  Now Im spending 40k for a 3 day event. I need to make a TON of money for the show to be profitable. I  have to cover all these costs, plus salesman's commisions and hotel bills too if I brought in a special sales team to augment my own sales staff.

If youre a small dealer, its tough to compete against this. If you have deep pockets and roll with both the good and bad, you MIGHT make it doing these type of shows.

And folks, it aint just MS who does this. With my new job I travel all over the US and I see every brand out there doing it in one form or another. Heck, if my partner and I could have afford it, we would have.

[Gary1911]

[quote author=buckeyespa

And folks, it aint just MS who does this. With my new job I travel all over the US and I see every brand out there doing it in one form or another. Heck, if my partner and I could have afford it, we would have.

[/quote]

Aint that the TRUTH !!!!!!!! I like the part about if HE COULD AFFORD IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It has to cost a BUNDLE BUT IF they KEEP doing it IT must be working
                                                            Gary

[masterge]

Lie.  Find Sundance dealers around the country.   Tell them you are moving to the area they serve.   Yes, go to mapquest, put in the dealer's zip and find a street.   Their practices are less than honorable and worst than car buying.   Most will come back with a quote that you can use to haggle with the local dealer.   I just saved almost $2K on a 2005 Cameo using these tactics.