Fees for Warranty Service

[Mr_Burns]

Sure, I don't expect my dealer to go broke servicing me. However, I do expect a dealer who charges a premium price for the tub, and sells his product on his service, not to hit me up for a Truck fee for every little thing. If after just a few weeks my cover lifter broke and it seemed that it was a faulty product, I'd expect the dealer to work with me.

After all, you want me to purchase my chemicals and supplies from you, be an advocate of your dealership and refer people to you, as well as come back for my next tub,  I'd like to think that something like this would be fixed sans a service fee.

[frankeyboy]

After all, you want me to purchase my chemicals and supplies from you, be an advocate of your dealership and refer people to you, as well as come back for my next tub,  I'd like to think that something like this would be fixed sans a service fee.

Just an update in case you missed it earlier.  I called the dealer to have the lifter fixed on Sunday afternoon.  I received a call back Monday morning, and Monday afternoon at 1pm it was fixed....at no charge, and no truck fee.  After reading my warranty closely I realized that the shocks are not covered by the warranty since they were very likely broken by misuse (although we had no documentation or training on how to use the lifter), and it does state the a "reduced rate truck fee" will be assesed for all warranty work ($45).  I am very happy with the service my dealer gave me, and although it is a 45 minute drive to his showroom, I am going to make the trip whenever I need supplies.  

Frankeyboy

[drewstar]

Frankie, maybe I missed it, but did the dealer have anything to say about the apparent corrosion, or have any ideas on why this thing blew out?

I'm glad to hear that you were taken care of.  

How do you like the phnematic cover lift (aside from the bad shock, lets assume that was an aberation and not the norm)?

Would you recomend them or next time go with the cheaper, non phneumatic style?

[frankeyboy]

Frankie, maybe I missed it, but did the dealer have anything to say about the apparent corrosion, or have any ideas on why this thing blew out?

I'm glad to hear that you were taken care of.  

How do you like the phnematic cover lift (aside from the bad shock, lets assume that was an aberation and not the norm)?

Would you recomend them or next time go with the cheaper, non phneumatic style?

I got this type of cover for two reasons.  One, it was the only type that would fit in the space between my tub and the railing of the deck (there is only 12 inches of space).  Two, it serves as a privacy screen (we have neighbors about 30 feet from the tub on the north side of the house) and the upright cover blocks their view.   This type of lifter makes it very easy to lift the cover.  After folding it in half, it will actually lift inself upright if you don't hang on to it, which is nice to help the wife and kids to lift it, but bad if they let it spring into place.

I mentioned the rust spots on the cover and he said that it is caused when the adjustable cross bar is extended during installation.  The metal grinds against itself removing some of the paint.  The exposed metal quickly rusts and drips onto the cover.  So far it has not stained the cover, and its easy to wipe off.  Considering how well they took care of me by replacing the shocks so quickly, I did'nt want to complain too much about the rust puddles.  I was not aware that this type of lifter costs more than the others, I just mentioned that I needed this type of lifter when we made the deal for the tub.  I would not recommend this brand (Superlift2 Ideal cover lift) because it is so easy to break the shocks, and the rusting problem, but apparently there are different brands of this type of lifter that don't have these problems.   Anyone have any brand and model recommendations for this type of lifter?

Frankeyboy

[drewstar]

I wasn't really given a choice of cover lifters when I purchased my tub. It was just included in the deal. IT's a covermate  and is just the basic rod that you manually lift up.

The tub is 7' x 7' so we are not talking about a HUGE tub/cover. It works well. Although somtimes i wonder, since i am always lifting the cover from one side of the tub, if the thing might twist out? I have no privacy issues and would have prefered to have a lifter that dropped the cover as far down as possible. (something I did not think of when buying this tub - my old round tub did not have a lifter and i was just thrilled to be getting one). No complaints though.  So far, so good.

On antother note: This whole service/truck fee thing has me wondering if there would be any feasability in some sort of "extended warrenty" option for tubs...pay a certian premium and all repairs, labor and even some maitainece will be taken care of?

Kinda like a AAA for hot tubs?  

[J._McD]

There are multiple cover lifters for the dealer to chose from depending the the needs and the circumstances surrounding the placement.  We use 6 different lifters and each one of them has a specific reason why it would be used in lieu of any other.  

We have an extensive discussion regading the most popular seating in the spa, what you will be looking at, the location of the equipment, service access, privacy, prevailing winds, the opening direction of the cover, space needed to recieve the cover etc.  

We do not like putting the cover brackets on the equipment panel side because it interfers with service access, of course the customer says they can just take it off for service.  This takes time and needs to be put back on and becomes an access problem for which WE MAY consider a charge for 1/4 hour time for doing so.  But then of course, the customer is certainly at liberty to remove it before service, but the customer usually see's the wisdom of our ways.  This is where you all want to tell me it should be included in the price you paid for the spa.  That makes you a very normal customer.

Drew's recommendation of an exteded warranty service to cover such charges such as trip charges, truck charges, access charges, gas charges even belly crawl charges.  That conversation would probably end the sale opportunity as they would walk.  BTW, We will NEVER crawl under a deck to work on a spa although we have been asked and expected to do so.  Sorry.  We also have this discussion in the planning and preparation discussions with our customer.  Sometime they don't listen and do it their way anyway.  Sorry.

During my years in this business, I once did just that.  The homeowner could not be home and assured me he would turn the power off as he had no way to control the power outside, (stupid, sorry).  I was only going to pull the power pak and bring it back to the shop for evaluation.  Well, I was stupid and didn't meter the line that I unscrewed and the wires I pulled out that FLASHED when pulling them from the metal enclosure and didn't trip.  The wires were hot.

My wife didn't know my travels for that day, the homeowner wasn't home, it was a lake front and probably would never have found me for a couple of days.  My people don't crawl, that's the rule, period.

The idea of an up front discussion about charges becomes another financial decision for the shopper and creates fear in his mind.  See Michigander's comments when you are honest up front.  You don't get the business and the competitor that lies or doesn't disclose same get's the business and 6 months later they come in and tell you the story of why they didn't buy from you and the competitor charged them but didn't tell them up front.  That's when the say "I am going to buy my next spa from you and I won't go back to him except for warranty, now can you take an hour and talk to me about water chemistry."  Dealers see this happen a thousand times over and over the longer they stay in this business.

Well, I've got the ba33's to tell you about it today.  Some people lately have an opinion about a truthful or is it an honest point of view, even if it differ's from norm or the way you see it.  Sorry about that, maybe there is a reason for my being blunt but truthful.

[Brewman]

In my case, the possiblity of dealer trip charges is stated in my warranty, which I read before I agreed to purchase the spa.  So I knew it was possible.  But my dealer doesn't choose to levy this cost.  
I'd take a discount on the purchase price over a trip charge waver.  
Brewman

[drewstar]

I think the key is to let the customer know exactly what is covered and not, what the charges before hand. There is nothing worse than getting blindsided with some charge that you thought was covered.

My dealer explined them to me upfront. And said "we MAY charge you a travel fee" It's at thier discretion.  I would think that if they were next door fixing Old lady's Johnson's pump and I needed the broken lifter installed,  I'd either be comped the charge since they were out there already, or maybe me and the old bag next door would split the charge....

My service idea was more along the lines of..."yup eveything is covered with your standard warrently...except x y and z. That's the industry standard. We also charge a truck fee  of $1 for calls within 30 miles,  etc

However, if you'd like we have a prefered maintence agreement, where we will come out  3 times a year, peform a water change, balance all the chemicals, perfom a routine maintece/check up on your tub, (and try to sell you additioanl chems and doo dads ). The prefered maintence agreement drops the truck fee down from $1 to 25 cents.  

I dunno. I'm just talking out loud.....

[ebirrane]

The idea of an up front discussion about charges becomes another financial decision for the shopper and creates fear in his mind.  See Michigander's comments when you are honest up front.  You don't get the business and the competitor that lies or doesn't disclose same get's the business ...

So you say: "I charge $45 gas/mileage/whatever charge, but it's a flat fee whether and many dealers do this because of X,Y,Z.  Look at the warranties of other dealers (what is in writing) and you will see this is a common practice."

Then, the newly enfeared customer goes to someone else, but includes that in their purchasing decisions.  Your competitor either charges the fee and has it in the materials, or your competitor does not charge the fee.

If your competitor also charges a fee and/or leaves themselves open to charging a fee in their verbage, you haven't lost an advantage. In fact, your honesty might have gained you an advantage.

If your competitor doesn't charge a fee, maybe you should ask yourself how they are able to make this more financially possible??

My dealer charges this fee (~$40) but I'm close by and won't pay it if I can just stop by and pick things up.  Fortunately, my HS hasn't had any problems in its first 1.5 years aside from a ball-bearing jet which came undone and we picked up a replacement.  But in talking to the repair guy there, he seemed pretty busy.  It seemed he had at least 3-4 jobs a day??

What's the math there? $160 a day. $800 for a 5 day work week. $41.6k a year?  Do manufacturers reimburse for labor as well as parts?  I hope not, because if my numbers are anywhere close to correct, that $40 fee is paying the repair guys salary!!

-Ed

[frankeyboy]

The truck fee things are all new to me.  I did not read the fine print in the warranty paperwork until it was too late.  I just assumed parts/labor includes everything including the cost to get to my house.  I have never had this type of fee mentioned when having any other item serviced at my house.  After reading all the posts regarding this, I think the truck fee is actually a good idea.  It will make me think twice about calling the repair guys out to adjust the pillows, or reprogram the cleaning cycles, or some other type of thing that I could easily fix myself if I just took the time to read the manual.

Frankeyboy

[Vinny]

drewstar,

I have a Covermate 3 which has the pneumatic shocks and it's great. Like frankeyboy, I bought it for the same 2 reasons: ease of operation, although it doesn't spring open like his, and the privacy it gives. If you don't mind a cover about a foot away from you and standing 1/2 the size of your tub tall, it really is a nice lifter IMO.

Vinny

[J._McD]

I think the key is to let the customer know exactly what is covered and not, what the charges before hand. There is nothing worse than getting blindsided with some charge that you thought was covered.

My dealer explined them to me upfront. And said "we MAY charge you a travel fee" It's at thier discretion.  I would think that if they were next door fixing Old lady's Johnson's pump and I needed the broken lifter installed,  I'd either be comped the charge since they were out there already, or maybe me and the old bag next door would split the charge....

My service idea was more along the lines of..."yup eveything is covered with your standard warrently...except x y and z. That's the industry standard. We also charge a truck fee  of $1 for calls within 30 miles,  etc

However, if you'd like we have a prefered maintence agreement, where we will come out  3 times a year, peform a water change, balance all the chemicals, perfom a routine maintece/check up on your tub, (and try to sell you additioanl chems and doo dads ). The prefered maintence agreement drops the truck fee down from $1 to 25 cents.  

I dunno. I'm just talking out loud.....

Drew, why do your relate to "old lady's Johnston's..." and the "the old bag next door....." are you aware how disrespectful that sounds and it makes you come across as both rude and crass with, well......then again, it tells us what you think.

And beside, don't you get my point, I tell them up front and they walk out the door and don't buy.  Don't you get it, most dealers don't tell you up fron and get the sale.  How silly of my, eh!  That's what I'm doing wrong.

[J._McD]

The truck fee things are all new to me.  I did not read the fine print in the warranty paperwork until it was too late.  I just assumed parts/labor includes everything including the cost to get to my house. .............After reading all the posts regarding this, I think the truck fee is actually a good idea.  It will make me think twice about calling the repair guys out to adjust the pillows, or reprogram the cleaning cycles, or some other type of thing that I could easily fix myself if I just took the time to read the manual.

Frankeyboy

Frankeyboy, no disrespect and no offense intended, but this has gone full circle and the whole ideal of a trip charge is summarized in your statement.  While I take a beating here for my outspoken manner, you have hit the nail on the head.  Do you understand how beneficial that is to every pre-newbie lurking in the background learning from these threads.  We learn by experience, and you had an experience.

It would be nice to think you shouldn't have to look for the fine print, but every warranty states it, "reasonable and customary travel repairman charges not just the gas.  Please refer to my earlier post where it stated, "help me help you" before I have to come out there.

Everybody thinks we are getting ungodly rich in this business catering to customer needs, when it cost us money to run and operate a business and they don't want to help us stay in business.  I wish there was a way, but as long as we rely on shoppers who want the lowest price to become customers that want everything at no charge, we are only going to go out of business and not be there for you.

I believe shoppers that get their input from in this forum are given some misguided advice that they believe is normal and the right thing to do.

Some of you may be shocked to know that we do do a very good business and that our customers are cared for like no other customer and more importantly, they are our friends.  

Do you cheat your friends, or take advantage of them?  And we appreciate customers that treat us like their frineds.  Do you take such actions that are referenced in this thread with your friends?

Our society has changed.

[drewstar]

Drew, why do your relate to "old lady's Johnston's..." and the "the old bag next door....." are you aware how disrespectful that sounds and it makes you come across as both rude and crass with, well......then again, it tells us what you think.

And beside, don't you get my point, I tell them up front and they walk out the door and don't buy.  Don't you get it, most dealers don't tell you up fron and get the sale.  How silly of my, eh!  That's what I'm doing wrong.

Did I say that YOU didn't tell them up front? It was a general observation.   "Calm down, Francis. "

Who was I being disrepectful to? Unless you are my fictious neghbor, I'd get over it.  Sounds like a personal problem to me....

[Bodyaches]

Gosh,
Dealers must be going broke.
What about us retirees that dont get increases to their retirement and cant afford extream charges or in a lot of other shafted charges that dealers charge. Same old crap, buyer beware.
To much greed out there. Nickel diming people is the way of life.

Dick