which ones are laminated?

[fatman]

I read a post a few days ago about hot tubs being laminated. I think it went on to say that Hot Spring tubs are not laminated so it would be physically impossible for them to have a lamination problem. Which hot tubs are laminated?

[HotTubMan]

Almost all spas are. I am not sure what Chas was talking about. Any acrylic spa has some lamination or bonding process on the shell. The acrylic is not strong enough to hold water, it needs to be backed with something for strength like fiberglass, ABS, there are other materials as well. Some manufacturers like D-1 and HotSpring offer thermal plastic shells that are availible only in white.

[HotTubMan]

A lot of similairities in shells between D-1 and HS.

[Chas]

 To quote from HotSpring.com: "Only Hot Spring offers Endurol®, a high-impact, co-extruded thermoplastic, which is a single, solid surface that can never de-laminate."  

The material is backed by ABS plastic which is co-extruded with the end result being that it cannot come apart. I have been around this stuff - from HotSpring and other makes such as D1 and a few 'knock-offs" for long enough to know it has a very good track record.  

The other surface they offer is called "Quarite Plus." This material starts with a sheet of Quarite and adds a layer of ABS backing. But this is done at the plastic manufacturing plant, in a controlled environment, at the plastic's melting temperatures, so the accurate way to describe it is "Co-extruded," or "molecular bonding." I'll leave out some of the more colorful ad-agency terms which have been dreamt up to describe it... Suffice to say, the materials become one sheet, which cannot come apart. That is the material which is then sent to Watkins to be pulled out of inventory just days before being thermo-formed.

At no point does HotSpring apply any fiberglass backing to the shell material. The only exception is the exterior side panels on some of the smaller "Solana" tubs, and the boxes which house the equipment.  

By comparison, most other tub makers - including Caldera and Sundance/Jacuzzi use "Quarite" or other acrylic sheet alone. It is vacuum molded and then layered with fiberglass. This has been 'fine tuned' over the years to make it a very durable way to build tubs.  

The thread where I posted this info the first time was a bit 'hot,' and people where making some rather interesting statements, some of which were moderated or later modified/deleted. But the crux of the matter was that some tub makers put a longer warranty on the "structure," than they put on the "surface."  

The "structure," which is the fiberglass backing and in some cases the wood supports around the tub, just doesn't tend to ever have problems. Even if it did, the warranty from most makers only covers 'loss of water due to defects in materials and workmanship."

[poolboy34]

To quote from HotSpring.com: "Only Hot Spring offers Endurol®, a high-impact, co-extruded thermoplastic, which is a single, solid surface that can never de-laminate."  
 
The material is backed by ABS plastic which is co-extruded with the end result being that it cannot come apart. I have been around this stuff - from HotSpring and other makes such as D1 "

Playing devil's advocate here....How can Hot Spring claim they are the only ones to use a thermal plastic shell when D-1 also has a thermal plastic shell?

[HotTubMan]

Playing devil's advocate here....How can Hot Spring claim they are the only ones to use a thermal plastic shell when D-1 also has a thermal plastic shell?

Jason, they are the only ones that use Endural, Just like D-1 is the only manufacturer using Ultra-Life. I think the point is Endural provided HS exclusively.

BTW, check your PM and get back to me, I want to email you those pics.

[tony]

I heard somewhere that the folks that started D-1 were originally HotSpring employees.  Anyone know for sure?

[poolboy34]

That would be false Tony.  The Hallums started out by selling spas in a small store, and then decided they could make a better product themselves.  25+ years later.............here they still are, running the day to day operations of one of the largest privately held spa manufacturers in the industry.  I actually got to meet both of them last winter when we visited the plant.

[tony]

Thanks for setting me straight.  I don't know where or how I hear these things.  

[Chas]

The Hallums started out by selling spas in a small store, and then decided they could make a better product themselves.

And the brand that they sold all those years ago was ??

[wetone]

And the brand that they sold all those years ago was ??


 

I give up, did the name start with an H?

[tony]

If the brand they sold was HotSprings, then I wasn't too far off.

[Bubbles]

So plastic backed with plastic makes the most sense? Delamination is so rare its a moot point really. Can't wait until they start building boats with this. Then again, wasn't the Titanic made of that same plastic?