dealer cost

[MaryM]

Car buyers can check average dealer cost through a number of sources - Edmonds, Kelly Blue Book, NADA.

Is there any such source, paper or internet, for spas?

Thanks,
Mary

[wmccall]

I didn't know worms came in cans!

[KC-SWO]

You will find that dealers are very protective of their cost information.  It is not readily available.

There are a lot of dealers on this board and this topic is strongly discouraged.

About the only thing you can do, is compare a price quoted to you, with prices others were quoted else-where.  That will tell you if you got a comparable deal to others.

[Dr. Spa™ Ret.]

Car buyers can check average dealer cost through a number of sources - Edmonds, Kelly Blue Book, NADA.

And you really believe this is the actual price the dealers pay for the vehicle??

The spa industry is not related to the automotive industry.

[MaryM]

The spa industry is not related to the automotive industry.

I know that there is a markup on *every* retail item. I am trying to figure out what is a fair price, and would like to make an offer based on that.  I was quoted over $10,000 for the following. It seems very high. I am in New England.

Sundance Otptima
Steps
Stereo w/remote
cover lift

Thanks,
Mary

[Mendocino101]

I think cost on that Sundance is like 12000.00 so the dealer is losing money and hoping it up in volume...... ....what that does make any sense.....he would lose money more quickly that way.....maybe you should check around and see what seems to be the market price for your area.....There are many SUndance owners here...I am sure they will be of help....

[wmccall]

Please nobody suggest that this is Dazed and Confused with a sex change operation .   Mary, you will get lots of good help here in this forum, but this is a question that won't get a good answer.  

To me, many dealers bring this on themselves. Some have everyday lists prices that they only hope they could sell it for and usually sell most spas at least a thousand or two less so everyone buys on sale!  Somewhere is a guy who wants the best and doesn't care what he spends on it and actually likes to brag about this $10000 spa.

[spaguyohio]

Sundance Optima, steps, cover, lift, start up chemicals, colorglo light, delivery - 8299.99 plus tax. Thats what my brother in law just paid for one in Erie, Pa this past weekend.

[stuart]

No there is not. Although the industry might eventually go to that someday in the future, right now we are still predominantly small business's pricing our services and goods according to what we feel it is worth to the consumer.

One of the most common misconceptions in the car industry is that consumers believe they are truly getting factory "wholesale" invoice. Don't believe for a moment that there is not a decent markup on every new car you buy. There is no way on earth that every car dealer in the world would be able to do sales like "match your down payment" or "$3000 instant cashback" in addition to the millions of dollars in advertising they do.

Look in any newspaper in the country and the largest and most expensive ads are always new car dealers.

How many new car dealers fail a year? Not near as many as most small business with goods and services like spas. Do you think it has anything to do with the fact that new car dealers are making a lot of money? How do you think they can afford the massive facilities they have?

I'm just trying to bring some reality to your question - believe me, there is a whole lot more markup and profit in the sale of a new auto then in the sale of a new spa!

I would love it if the factories would come up with a system that standardized price so that it made it easier for the dealers and then just paid us a "kick back" off of the wholesale. It would certainly cut back on the dickering if I could show you a "dealer price" with my profit hidden in the factory invoice!

Understand that across the board, spas built the same components using the same materials will cost the same to build and should be similarly priced. If you do plenty of research and compare apples to apples you will be able to judge whether your getting a good price. The only way this doesn’t work is when someone sells deceptively and claims a component on their product is the same as another when indeed it isn’t.

Sorry for the rant but this just came up with a customer that is a car dealer and it became quite frustrating before it was over.

I didn't know worms came in cans!

How'd I do at filling the can?  

[BobRex]

Let's approach this from a different angle.  I agree that car prices aren't a good model.

How about electronics?  I used to work for what was considered a "high end" audio store ( you know, the 5K amplifiers, 20K speakers.....)  Our markup was pretty much common knowledge or at least available to those willing to spend some time looking (damned internet.)
Every knowledgable customer "knew" that our products were 60 or 50 point lines.  Additionally, the list prices were pretty much national.  It didn't matter where you went, the list price was the same.  To me that's the real key here.  I don't know of any "list price" lists for spas.
I can't compare one 8K spa to another because I don't really know what I'm comparing.  Is one spa actually more expensive than another?  Is one dealer making a larger profit?  Are the accessories added by one dealer "better" than another?  How would I know?

Now if I at least had a list price, I could look at who was giving the better deal.  I'd be able to measure price against service department against dealer satisfaction.
We made most of our sales based upon the fact that we had an in-house serviceman.  Many competing audio stores didn't.  To many people, that was worth a little extra to have that security.  To some people, it didn't matter, and we lost some of those sales.  To a large degeee, I can't factor that security into a spa decision.

Would dealer cost help?  Sure, why not.  But I'd be much happier with a real list price.  

[shoemaker]

Mary M,

Everyone here knows where you where going with your question. I personally think it's a very fair question to ask. Although, like the car salesman, you will not get a straight answer here or anywhere else.

Like any good business, the "actual" cost to produce a product is never released to the public. If you think about it, if I make widgets and they cost me a dollar to make and I sell them for $10, do you think I want you to know that they cost me a buck? If everyone knew that info I would go out of business in no time because everyone would want to pay $1.10 for my widgets.

Anyway, you will find that like cars, Spa prices are negotiable. So don't just accept the first price that is offered. There are about 4 or 5 other makers of hot tubs with comparable models. Check them all out and then negotiate (sp) the best price.

I also live in New England (Massachusetts) and also interested in a good Spa at a good price. Where in NE do you live?

[Brewman]

I know that there is a markup on *every* retail item. I am trying to figure out what is a fair price, and would like to make an offer based on that.  I was quoted over $10,000 for the following. It seems very high. I am in New England.

Sundance Otptima
Steps
Stereo w/remote
cover lift

Thanks,
Mary

Give negotiation a try.  You won't find any definitive dealer cost information.   Compare that spa to other brands, at least that will give you an idea of the cost of spas in your area.

Brewman

[stuart]

Let's approach this from a different angle.  I agree that car prices aren't a good model.

How about electronics?  I used to work for what was considered a "high end" audio store ( you know, the 5K amplifiers, 20K speakers.....)  Our markup was pretty much common knowledge or at least available to those willing to spend some time looking (damned internet.)
Every knowledgable customer "knew" that our products were 60 or 50 point lines.  Additionally, the list prices were pretty much national.  It didn't matter where you went, the list price was the same.  To me that's the real key here.  I don't know of any "list price" lists for spas.
I can't compare one 8K spa to another because I don't really know what I'm comparing.  Is one spa actually more expensive than another?  Is one dealer making a larger profit?  Are the accessories added by one dealer "better" than another?  How would I know?

Now if I at least had a list price, I could look at who was giving the better deal.  I'd be able to measure price against service department against dealer satisfaction.
We made most of our sales based upon the fact that we had an in-house serviceman.  Many competing audio stores didn't.  To many people, that was worth a little extra to have that security.  To some people, it didn't matter, and we lost some of those sales.  To a large degeee, I can't factor that security into a spa decision.

Would dealer cost help?  Sure, why not.  But I'd be much happier with a real list price.  

Let's take your scenario of 60 to 50 point lines for an example.

Let's say I sell a spa for $5000 and make 50 points (fat chance!) which should mean a $2500 profit. I take out of that $150 for the cost of delivery using 2 men, spa dolly, truck, wear on straps and tools. Then I take out $300 for commission, $60 for start up chemicals, $60 for steps, $130 for cover lift the salesman "threw in", $120 to replace the boards on the deck that got "scratched" during the delivery, $100 for the workman’s comp. insurance I had to pay on the guy that got hurt when the customer "tried to help", $250 for the cost per person on advertising to get you into the store, $150 I had to pay for you using a credit card, $80 I have to pay in literature and labor for paperwork handling. That leaves me $1100 to pay rent, lights, incidental business costs not counting all of the extra phone calls and non-warranty trips to your house because you didn't read the owners manual and didn't know how to operate the spa and free water tests.

Considering most warranties are around 5 years and most customers believe that means that the dealership will baby-sit everything for that timeframe, that isn't enough profit to stay in business. BTW, most spa dealers would love to get even 40 points before all of those things but don't...

I hope this sheds some light without sounding “snide”.

All of these things are real costs not including tons of other potential loss items like damaged covers, scratches on cabinets and extra delivery times because we weren’t informed of an 8ft deck , 20 stairs and that pile of wood we had to move to get the spa in!

[johnnythunders]

Why don't you all leave DAZE alone and let him enjoy his Gulf Coast Spa.Heard he spent $7000 on it...Jt

[Sol_Dahbrishinsky]

NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT
TRUE TRUE TRUE TRUE TRUE TRUE TRUE TRUE TRUE

They matched the Costco price of 3495 and they threw in 10 years of chemicals and 24 hour a day service......
The only hold up is whether to ozone or not......
That is his next decision (the dealer said the deal was good for 15 years)