Low Alkalinity High PH Problem

[DJJ]

I just changed my water and am in the process of balancing things. I am having a hard time getting my PH and Alkalinity in the proper range. Every time I try to raise my Alkalinity, my PH goes up as well. If I try to lower my PH, my Alkalinity drops as well. I presently have a PH of 8.0 (high) and Alkalinity of 36(low). Can somebody please HELP! This is driving me batty. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated!

[swilly1000]

Prioritize the alkalinity and the PH will follow.

[bradleyabell]

I just changed my water and am in the process of balancing things. I am having a hard time getting my PH and Alkalinity in the proper range. Every time I try to raise my Alkalinity, my PH goes up as well. If I try to lower my PH, my Alkalinity drops as well. I presently have a PH of 8.0 (high) and Alkalinity of 36(low). Can somebody please HELP! This is driving me batty. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated!

Add PH Up into your tub...They pull on each other so if you keep raising the PH, it will force the alkalinity up, while eventually pulling PH down.  It's a fine balancing act.

[DJJ]

So I have 2 conflicting ideas. Raise the Alkalinity and the PH will follow. Raise the PH and the Alkalinity will follow. Hmmmm.

[dave123]

I'm having the same problem. My alkalinity starts out low, 25ppm, with a pH in the high 6's. Once I get alk to 80+ppm the pH shoots to 8.6 - 8.8 and stays there. Powder pH down doesn't bring it down. I'm on well water which could have something to do with it from what I read. Also, when adding bromine, I get green scum at the water line which I also read indicates the bromine is reacting with metals in the water. I also know I have hard water b/c the builder had to install a water softener based on the well report. Outside hose bibs do not get softened water fed to them.

I just drained the tub today and started over, refilling using a 1 micron hose attachment filter. I've read of other having success with this method. Did a quick alkalinity test of the filtered water, and it read ~25ppm so no difference starting out, but hopefully the filter nabbed whatever was spiking the pH when the alk increaser hits.

For reference, I'm using Spa Guard chemicals b/c thats what the shop near me sells.

[swilly1000]

They kinda go hand in hand.  Do some googling.  I would try alkalinity first.  Experiment without mirco-managing.

[castletonia]

Always balance alkalinity first. 

[Upstate_Dunadan]

We got a new Grandee this past spring.  At first I tried to balance both PH and Alk perfectly but it always failed.  I now focus on keeping PH where it needs to be and don't worry about Alk.   Alk seems to stay about where it need to be but not perfect.  If I try to fine tune Alk after getting PH set, it messes up PH so I stopped trying.  Seems to work well.  Once a month or so I check PH and bring PH back in check and I'm good.

[bradleyabell]

So I have 2 conflicting ideas. Raise the Alkalinity and the PH will follow. Raise the PH and the Alkalinity will follow. Hmmmm.

Sorry, I meant to say add PH Down.  Although if your PH is high and your alkaline is low, they should pull each other and within a few days be much closer to each other than before...If not though, I would definitely add a cup of PH Down

[ratchett]

We got a new Grandee this past spring.  At first I tried to balance both PH and Alk perfectly but it always failed.  I now focus on keeping PH where it needs to be and don't worry about Alk.   Alk seems to stay about where it need to be but not perfect.  If I try to fine tune Alk after getting PH set, it messes up PH so I stopped trying.  Seems to work well.  Once a month or so I check PH and bring PH back in check and I'm good.

I've got a new 2019 Hotspring Highlife and my dealer's care routine only has me checking the PH once a month, adding baking soda as needed to raise PH (it will lower on it's own).  Aside from Dichlor 56 after a soak and cleaning the filters there's no other maintenance in my care plan.

[Upstate_Dunadan]

Yea...it's super easy.  No need to overthink it.

[HotTubLife]

Not sure if this will help you or not. But on the off chance it helps *someone*, here it is.

I struggled with this problem for a long time. The issue seemed to be that, although the water would initially measure in the ideal range, with an appropriate level of alkalinity, the PH would eventually creep down over time. Ultimately, it was no longer possible to increase the PH without also screwing up the alkalinity readings. I started using the FreshWater brand PH Balance product with some modest success. But what I eventually discovered is that the chlorinating granules that I was adding (to supplement the salt-cell sanitation system) were producing cyanuric acid, and that this was lowering my PH, but not the alkalinity (for some reason). I was really having a hell of a time with it. Like you, I was being driven nuts.

However, when it came time to replace my ACE Salt Cell and I saw the price tag on that baby, I stumbled on the fix for all of this. I ended up buying a much less expensive salt cell (The Scepter) and that alone seems to have solved the problem. This cell seems to work much better than the original ACE cell - I haven't had to add chlorine in any form for a couple of months now (and I am in this thing every single morning and the water remains gin-clear). Once I get the PH settled after a water change/addition, everything else is fine and stays that way. I have had virtually no maintenance to do to keep the water perfectly clear.

The only battle is with phosphate/foam from skin-care products. I am spending part of the day tackling that. Wish me luck!

[DJJ]

I am still fighting a losing battle. Alkalinity-44/PH-7.9. I add Alkalinity Increaser. Alkalinity-59/PH-8.2. I add Alkalinity Increaser...… I am afraid to even check the water now. I'm sure my PH is up around 8.5. Once my Alkalinity is balanced, I will have to try and bring the PH down, which I am sure will lower my Alkalinity. I'm ready to light the spa on fire.

[bud16415]

Not sure if this will help you or not. But on the off chance it helps *someone*, here it is.

I struggled with this problem for a long time. The issue seemed to be that, although the water would initially measure in the ideal range, with an appropriate level of alkalinity, the PH would eventually creep down over time. Ultimately, it was no longer possible to increase the PH without also screwing up the alkalinity readings. I started using the FreshWater brand PH Balance product with some modest success. But what I eventually discovered is that the chlorinating granules that I was adding (to supplement the salt-cell sanitation system) were producing cyanuric acid, and that this was lowering my PH, but not the alkalinity (for some reason). I was really having a hell of a time with it. Like you, I was being driven nuts.

However, when it came time to replace my ACE Salt Cell and I saw the price tag on that baby, I stumbled on the fix for all of this. I ended up buying a much less expensive salt cell (The Scepter) and that alone seems to have solved the problem. This cell seems to work much better than the original ACE cell - I haven't had to add chlorine in any form for a couple of months now (and I am in this thing every single morning and the water remains gin-clear). Once I get the PH settled after a water change/addition, everything else is fine and stays that way. I have had virtually no maintenance to do to keep the water perfectly clear.

The only battle is with phosphate/foam from skin-care products. I am spending part of the day tackling that. Wish me luck!

Similar to your solution where the new cell produces pure chlorine liquid household bleach does much the same. Dichlor is what people normally use for supplemental chlorine and dichlor is made for pools that are subject to sunlight and sunlight depletes the stabilizer / acid that is added in. So in a hot tub a little stabilizers 50PPM is a good thing more than that is not. Liquid bleach has none. As far as I know there isn’t a granular product good for a hot tub without the added stabilizer. 

I use dichlor watching my stabilizer number and when it reaches 50PPM I switch over to the cheaper bleach. Roughly 1 tablespoon dichlor = 1/3 cup bleach. With adding water etc when it hits 30PPM I switch back.   

[HotTubLife]

Similar to your solution where the new cell produces pure chlorine liquid household bleach does much the same. Dichlor is what people normally use for supplemental chlorine and dichlor is made for pools that are subject to sunlight and sunlight depletes the stabilizer / acid that is added in. So in a hot tub a little stabilizers 50PPM is a good thing more than that is not. Liquid bleach has none. As far as I know there isn’t a granular product good for a hot tub without the added stabilizer. 

I use dichlor watching my stabilizer number and when it reaches 50PPM I switch over to the cheaper bleach. Roughly 1 tablespoon dichlor = 1/3 cup bleach. With adding water etc when it hits 30PPM I switch back.   

Since my spa is covered, stabilizer to prevent UV depletion doesn't seem to be of much help. In any event, I haven't noticed any ill effects from leaving it off entirely. And I noticed that the salt levels crept up slowly but surely when I was adding a small amount of household bleach every week. So I stopped doing that, too. These days, I add absolutely nothing and the water has been gin-clear for months. Perhaps my luck will run out, but so far, so good!