Salt Water System?

[BullFrogSpasMN]

Keep in mind as mentioned above the Blu Fusion is a sodium bromide tub and will take a more expensive salt. I have never seen one but the directions suggest cleaning the anode device by adding a descaler to the water. Maybe BullFrogSpas wil comment on that interval and the procedure. Is it done just before a water change etc?

The only one I have seen has the anode device just sitting in the tub and you take it out when using the tub. With it being a loose part it seemed easy to soak and clean. It uses the cheaper NaCl but produces chlorine not bromine. I don’t drain my spa on the yard normally but I don’t think that level of NaCl would harm grass, but I don’t know that as a fact.

I can’t find a lot of information on salt water tubs and how they interact with things like biofilm etc.

One question I had was what would happen if I just added salt to my tub like it had a salt gen unit and still used dichlor. Would I get the benefits of the softer feeling water as well? Could a person do that to get a feel for the salt water say before a water change to see if they like it?     

Correct, it does use Sodium Bromide which will run you approx. $10-$13 per pound (retail), thankfully we have a managed a way to save extra expense and pass it along by buying it in bulk 300-400 lbs at a time straight from the source, with that said our largest spa we sell still only requires approx. 7 lbs to "start-up" the system.  We send out a tech (with customers onsite) who installs the system internally, it does have a control panel we will install into the cabinet if the customer so chooses otherwise the system can essentially remain "hidden" within the cabinet, no cells dangling over the side, no power cords running across the deck, etc. just a nice clean hidden install.

I MUCH prefer a Bromine based system over competitors such as ACE, Bromine vs Chlorine is much more stable with a much lower dissipation rate in water temps over 97 degrees, Bromine based systems will also work much more reliably over a broader ph/Alk./Calcium Hardness range which essentially means the system itself is much less "finicky" Now I'm not saying we have that loose water-care approach with customers, we still educate and let them know the importance of maintaining proper water parameters but the system itself will produce sanitizer MUCH easier than a chlorine based system in adverse water conditions and it's not even close.  We fill the spa up, add a small amount of Phosphate Stabilizer to the water, balance pH/Alk then add the appropriate amount of salt and you are off and running.  As far as cleaning the cell the manufacturer pre-packages a "cell cleaner" which is essentially muriatic acid diluted to be more "customer friendly" we install the cell with unions so it can easily be removed for a yearly cleaning.  The Blu Fusion system we sell has a full 3 year warranty on the cell (full meaning if it fails in 2 yrs. 11 months it gets replaced in FULL) and replacements with 1 hr of technician time comes in just under $500.  The actual 'hours rating' on the cell puts it around 4 years of usage, vs the ACE cell which I believe is rated right around 16-20 months as far as 'hours rating' (going off memory, but I have all the #'s at the office).  Again just another option, I don't jump up on a hot tub and scream to the high heavens that everyone and their brother needs to buy a salt system or they are foolish, we simply educate/inform/give all the potential costs and let the customer make that decision for themselves.

probably more info than anyone cares to know, but once I start rambling...lol

Good Luck!

[bud16415]

Keep in mind as mentioned above the Blu Fusion is a sodium bromide tub and will take a more expensive salt. I have never seen one but the directions suggest cleaning the anode device by adding a descaler to the water. Maybe BullFrogSpas wil comment on that interval and the procedure. Is it done just before a water change etc?

The only one I have seen has the anode device just sitting in the tub and you take it out when using the tub. With it being a loose part it seemed easy to soak and clean. It uses the cheaper NaCl but produces chlorine not bromine. I don’t drain my spa on the yard normally but I don’t think that level of NaCl would harm grass, but I don’t know that as a fact.

I can’t find a lot of information on salt water tubs and how they interact with things like biofilm etc.

One question I had was what would happen if I just added salt to my tub like it had a salt gen unit and still used dichlor. Would I get the benefits of the softer feeling water as well? Could a person do that to get a feel for the salt water say before a water change to see if they like it?     

Correct, it does use Sodium Bromide which will run you approx. $10-$13 per pound (retail), thankfully we have a managed a way to save extra expense and pass it along by buying it in bulk 300-400 lbs at a time straight from the source, with that said our largest spa we sell still only requires approx. 7 lbs to "start-up" the system.  We send out a tech (with customers onsite) who installs the system internally, it does have a control panel we will install into the cabinet if the customer so chooses otherwise the system can essentially remain "hidden" within the cabinet, no cells dangling over the side, no power cords running across the deck, etc. just a nice clean hidden install.

I MUCH prefer a Bromine based system over competitors such as ACE, Bromine vs Chlorine is much more stable with a much lower dissipation rate in water temps over 97 degrees, Bromine based systems will also work much more reliably over a broader ph/Alk./Calcium Hardness range which essentially means the system itself is much less "finicky" Now I'm not saying we have that loose water-care approach with customers, we still educate and let them know the importance of maintaining proper water parameters but the system itself will produce sanitizer MUCH easier than a chlorine based system in adverse water conditions and it's not even close.  We fill the spa up, add a small amount of Phosphate Stabilizer to the water, balance pH/Alk then add the appropriate amount of salt and you are off and running.  As far as cleaning the cell the manufacturer pre-packages a "cell cleaner" which is essentially muriatic acid diluted to be more "customer friendly" we install the cell with unions so it can easily be removed for a yearly cleaning.  The Blu Fusion system we sell has a full 3 year warranty on the cell (full meaning if it fails in 2 yrs. 11 months it gets replaced in FULL) and replacements with 1 hr of technician time comes in just under $500.  The actual 'hours rating' on the cell puts it around 4 years of usage, vs the ACE cell which I believe is rated right around 16-20 months as far as 'hours rating' (going off memory, but I have all the #'s at the office).  Again just another option, I don't jump up on a hot tub and scream to the high heavens that everyone and their brother needs to buy a salt system or they are foolish, we simply educate/inform/give all the potential costs and let the customer make that decision for themselves.

probably more info than anyone cares to know, but once I start rambling...lol

Good Luck!

Thanks for the information. Few more questions if I may.

Is there any brand of tub that you know of that if a costumer came in and asked you to install one for them that you would have to tell them “your tub is not compatible with salt, or adding this to your tub would nullify their factory warranty?

In the case of the Ace system I assume when you add the Ace you are getting the same components in the tub as if you bought it without the Ace.
Seals, jets and heaters etc?    The parts I hear that don’t stand up to salt.

[BullFrogSpasMN]

Keep in mind as mentioned above the Blu Fusion is a sodium bromide tub and will take a more expensive salt. I have never seen one but the directions suggest cleaning the anode device by adding a descaler to the water. Maybe BullFrogSpas wil comment on that interval and the procedure. Is it done just before a water change etc?

The only one I have seen has the anode device just sitting in the tub and you take it out when using the tub. With it being a loose part it seemed easy to soak and clean. It uses the cheaper NaCl but produces chlorine not bromine. I don’t drain my spa on the yard normally but I don’t think that level of NaCl would harm grass, but I don’t know that as a fact.

I can’t find a lot of information on salt water tubs and how they interact with things like biofilm etc.

One question I had was what would happen if I just added salt to my tub like it had a salt gen unit and still used dichlor. Would I get the benefits of the softer feeling water as well? Could a person do that to get a feel for the salt water say before a water change to see if they like it?     

Correct, it does use Sodium Bromide which will run you approx. $10-$13 per pound (retail), thankfully we have a managed a way to save extra expense and pass it along by buying it in bulk 300-400 lbs at a time straight from the source, with that said our largest spa we sell still only requires approx. 7 lbs to "start-up" the system.  We send out a tech (with customers onsite) who installs the system internally, it does have a control panel we will install into the cabinet if the customer so chooses otherwise the system can essentially remain "hidden" within the cabinet, no cells dangling over the side, no power cords running across the deck, etc. just a nice clean hidden install.

I MUCH prefer a Bromine based system over competitors such as ACE, Bromine vs Chlorine is much more stable with a much lower dissipation rate in water temps over 97 degrees, Bromine based systems will also work much more reliably over a broader ph/Alk./Calcium Hardness range which essentially means the system itself is much less "finicky" Now I'm not saying we have that loose water-care approach with customers, we still educate and let them know the importance of maintaining proper water parameters but the system itself will produce sanitizer MUCH easier than a chlorine based system in adverse water conditions and it's not even close.  We fill the spa up, add a small amount of Phosphate Stabilizer to the water, balance pH/Alk then add the appropriate amount of salt and you are off and running.  As far as cleaning the cell the manufacturer pre-packages a "cell cleaner" which is essentially muriatic acid diluted to be more "customer friendly" we install the cell with unions so it can easily be removed for a yearly cleaning.  The Blu Fusion system we sell has a full 3 year warranty on the cell (full meaning if it fails in 2 yrs. 11 months it gets replaced in FULL) and replacements with 1 hr of technician time comes in just under $500.  The actual 'hours rating' on the cell puts it around 4 years of usage, vs the ACE cell which I believe is rated right around 16-20 months as far as 'hours rating' (going off memory, but I have all the #'s at the office).  Again just another option, I don't jump up on a hot tub and scream to the high heavens that everyone and their brother needs to buy a salt system or they are foolish, we simply educate/inform/give all the potential costs and let the customer make that decision for themselves.

probably more info than anyone cares to know, but once I start rambling...lol

Good Luck!

Thanks for the information. Few more questions if I may.

Is there any brand of tub that you know of that if a costumer came in and asked you to install one for them that you would have to tell them “your tub is not compatible with salt, or adding this to your tub would nullify their factory warranty?

In the case of the Ace system I assume when you add the Ace you are getting the same components in the tub as if you bought it without the Ace.
Seals, jets and heaters etc?    The parts I hear that don’t stand up to salt.

1. To be honest I don't really get a lot of opportunities to sell to other brands where they are still under factory warranty, reason being is most customers will return to their original dealer for supplies/filters/etc. for the first few years, or they will simply buy products from Amazon.  We have installed on Bullfrog, Nordic, Master Spas, Caldera, Sundance, Dynasty, and even a Cal Spa where I think the system itself was worth more than the tub but he really wanted it :-) Given the opportunity I'll sell & install it on any brand during warranty or not because I know if the water is maintained properly there will be 0 issues.

2. No parts or equipment is different in regards to the ACE System/Hot Spring Tubs, there is no reason to have different parts, heaters, gaskets, etc.

Good Luck!

[bud16415]

Keep in mind as mentioned above the Blu Fusion is a sodium bromide tub and will take a more expensive salt. I have never seen one but the directions suggest cleaning the anode device by adding a descaler to the water. Maybe BullFrogSpas wil comment on that interval and the procedure. Is it done just before a water change etc?

The only one I have seen has the anode device just sitting in the tub and you take it out when using the tub. With it being a loose part it seemed easy to soak and clean. It uses the cheaper NaCl but produces chlorine not bromine. I don’t drain my spa on the yard normally but I don’t think that level of NaCl would harm grass, but I don’t know that as a fact.

I can’t find a lot of information on salt water tubs and how they interact with things like biofilm etc.

One question I had was what would happen if I just added salt to my tub like it had a salt gen unit and still used dichlor. Would I get the benefits of the softer feeling water as well? Could a person do that to get a feel for the salt water say before a water change to see if they like it?     

Correct, it does use Sodium Bromide which will run you approx. $10-$13 per pound (retail), thankfully we have a managed a way to save extra expense and pass it along by buying it in bulk 300-400 lbs at a time straight from the source, with that said our largest spa we sell still only requires approx. 7 lbs to "start-up" the system.  We send out a tech (with customers onsite) who installs the system internally, it does have a control panel we will install into the cabinet if the customer so chooses otherwise the system can essentially remain "hidden" within the cabinet, no cells dangling over the side, no power cords running across the deck, etc. just a nice clean hidden install.

I MUCH prefer a Bromine based system over competitors such as ACE, Bromine vs Chlorine is much more stable with a much lower dissipation rate in water temps over 97 degrees, Bromine based systems will also work much more reliably over a broader ph/Alk./Calcium Hardness range which essentially means the system itself is much less "finicky" Now I'm not saying we have that loose water-care approach with customers, we still educate and let them know the importance of maintaining proper water parameters but the system itself will produce sanitizer MUCH easier than a chlorine based system in adverse water conditions and it's not even close.  We fill the spa up, add a small amount of Phosphate Stabilizer to the water, balance pH/Alk then add the appropriate amount of salt and you are off and running.  As far as cleaning the cell the manufacturer pre-packages a "cell cleaner" which is essentially muriatic acid diluted to be more "customer friendly" we install the cell with unions so it can easily be removed for a yearly cleaning.  The Blu Fusion system we sell has a full 3 year warranty on the cell (full meaning if it fails in 2 yrs. 11 months it gets replaced in FULL) and replacements with 1 hr of technician time comes in just under $500.  The actual 'hours rating' on the cell puts it around 4 years of usage, vs the ACE cell which I believe is rated right around 16-20 months as far as 'hours rating' (going off memory, but I have all the #'s at the office).  Again just another option, I don't jump up on a hot tub and scream to the high heavens that everyone and their brother needs to buy a salt system or they are foolish, we simply educate/inform/give all the potential costs and let the customer make that decision for themselves.

probably more info than anyone cares to know, but once I start rambling...lol

Good Luck!

Thanks for the information. Few more questions if I may.

Is there any brand of tub that you know of that if a costumer came in and asked you to install one for them that you would have to tell them “your tub is not compatible with salt, or adding this to your tub would nullify their factory warranty?

In the case of the Ace system I assume when you add the Ace you are getting the same components in the tub as if you bought it without the Ace.
Seals, jets and heaters etc?    The parts I hear that don’t stand up to salt.

1. To be honest I don't really get a lot of opportunities to sell to other brands where they are still under factory warranty, reason being is most customers will return to their original dealer for supplies/filters/etc. for the first few years, or they will simply buy products from Amazon.  We have installed on Bullfrog, Nordic, Master Spas, Caldera, Sundance, Dynasty, and even a Cal Spa where I think the system itself was worth more than the tub but he really wanted it :-) Given the opportunity I'll sell & install it on any brand during warranty or not because I know if the water is maintained properly there will be 0 issues.

2. No parts or equipment is different in regards to the ACE System/Hot Spring Tubs, there is no reason to have different parts, heaters, gaskets, etc.

Good Luck!

Thanks for the info.

[Cricket]

BullFrogSpasMN - Has Bullfrog approved Blu Fusion to be installed on their spas?  According to their blog they don't really recommend it.  It would appear that it does nullify factory warranty?

http://www.bullfrogspas.com/blog/hot-tub-chemicals-guide/

[The Wizard of Spas]

A few notes that others have pointed out:  Pool SALT systems are NOT like *most* hot tub systems (NaCl vs Sodium Bromide).  The marketing is the key- Its an automated system so if we call it SALT people will naturally gravitate towards it.

But this is the thing (again, kinda hinted at by others here):  Swimming pools does not have near the options of sanitization that hot tubs do.  For whatever reason, people strive to find ways to treat their hot tub like they treat their pools.  This is the exact opposite of how it should be.

There are a whole lot of ways to sanitize a hot tub.  The benefits of a "salt" system can be replicated via numerous sanitization systems that are exclusive to hot tubs, w/out the initial cost and (most importantly) the cost down the line when the salt cell needs to be replaced. 

I say this a guy who sells *both* swimming pool and hot tub salt systems.  I like the hot tub salt systems.  But I just don't think the juice is worth the squeeze.  If it is what you have/what you want, I'll let you know the pros and cons of said decision.  But in most cases, you can get all the benefits of a "salt" system w/o the cost and WITH the ease of an "automated" system.

I hope this helps.