Hot springs Vista/Grandee or Sundance Optima?

[IonHeaven]

You should sell hot tubs calico! As for me I have a hard time adjusting individual jets. Its hard on my sore hand. The slippery metal things to lower the jets on the optima made it even more difficult for me. The easiest ones for me to turn were on the Beachcomber. However, for neck/shoulder therapy I'm back to the HS and though I did not wet test the Envoy I did wet test the Vista. I found enough control without having to turn individual jets, which for me is important. The Marquis Reward has excellent control without dealing with individual jets.

All this analyzing features keeps making me sway back and forth...but I know how helpful reading these posts have been to me, so I though I'd add my 2 cents (maybe less).

Reading all this stuff has helped me to be aware of what I was looking for and how to compare wet tests. Wet testing is such an important part of this decision, I hope I don't make the wrong choice purchasing an Envoy that I was not able to wet test.

Hope to be soaking soon. IonHeaven

[CalicoskiesNC]

Ion, what you just mentioned, thats the kind of info I found so helpful when I was searching on tub models.  I took lots of notes and it helped me to ask more questions and look at details when testing.  

I'm in banking, not hot tub sales!  

[IonHeaven]

Sobe,
I didn't think I cared for the motomassage at first either, but it definately grew on me. I would prefer the Vista over the Grandee since for me one moto massage would be enough and I really liked the captain's seat in the Vista.

Though I loved the Vista, I need to go a bit smaller, so I'm still considering ordering the un-wet tested Envoy... hoping it will fit my needs.

[ebirrane]

I hope this helps others that have been misled by a dealer trying to show power instead of showing both power and water control.  As seen above the dealer has completely convinced customers that this tub is used for a high pressure pounding massage instead of that it has the control to give you that if it is what you want (maybe for a athlete).  Good luck on all that will buying soon and please wet test with some knowledge of tub control and do not put you backs in the hands of “Tim The Toolman” dealer that think more power is the best selling feature.

Agreed.  You will notice that the post that started it all said the optima jets were more "powerful" and "better placed".  Certainly Sundance has put very powerful pumps in their tub, and I am sure the price reflects it! I personally doubt that dealers completely miss the complexities of diverter settings. The posters on the wall of my Sundance dealer show the fluidex (sp?) pounding away!

Perhaps specifically for those who get caught by a "Tim the Toolman" dealer:

1) Sundance dealers may push the jet power and infer that all other tubs are underpowered and that is misleading.

2) Sundance dealers may state that their jets hit muscles better than other tubs. I'm sure the little blow-up of the muscles of the back wasn't hand-drawn by my specific dealer! That claim is also misleading.

The optima has varied speed pumps, as do some other tubs. The pros/cons of such pumps was a line of disucssion on this board already. Some love it, some don't.

The optima has diverters, as do most tubs.  The optima has individually settable jets, as do most tubs.  Some tubs also allow you to pop off one type of jet and put on another to better customize your massage. This can be good or bad (customization versus possibly cheap construction).

Most tubs of this size by major manufacturers can make quite a sizable list of permutations of massage type based on pump power, diverter setting, and jet type.

Some people like the foot dome, others feel it keeps people's legs too close together when the tub is full.  Some people love the handles (we did) others think they are ugly. Some people like the stainless steel jets, others feel they are hard to turn. Some people love the pop-up speakers, some find them horrendous. Some people, possibly atheletes, may really need the back-numbing poundings. A vast majority of soakers, however, do not.

The decision to purchase an optima, or any tub, is a combination of all of these things and deciding which things are important for you.  The optima is not the "killer-app" tub and many dealers trick inexperienced buyers into the power and placement debate.  Does that mean it is a bad tub? For me it sure is! For you it sure isn't!

But it doesn't mean that people that do the evaluation and reject it for something which, to them, is 10 times better, are incapable of understanding the true optima offerings. And that opinion *is* directed at people who are currently wet testing and are unsure of how to evaluate a wet test.

Actually, we should leave the word "optima" out of it, start a new topic on how to wet test, and see how people use those tests to make purchasing decisions.

Peace.

-Ed

[ebirrane]

Of course all jets in these three seats can be adjusted also from off to high to help control massage level.

Just a small point, some hot tub manufacturers, and I honestly do not know if Sundance is one of them, strongly recommend that you do not turn all of the jets on a particular pump off or on low because of the stress it puts on the pump (or jets) or something.  Maybe someone with more technical plumbing knowledge or a dealer can expand on that if it is the case.

-Ed

[Brewman]

It is explained in the Optima (sorry for uttering the "O" word, seems to be an evil thing in this thread) owners manual to keep a minimum of 6 jets open, if I recall.
The exact number may not be correct, I don't have my manual handy.  
BTW, the seats that have the individually adjustable jets are on a 2 speed pump, which delivers a lower intensity massage when run at the lower speed.  
Brewman

[sobe]

I guess that buying a hot tub is a very personal experience and everyone has his or hers  opinion which might be based upon a multiple factors. I think either of the companies hot tubs are rated very high and you can't go wrong with either.
Wet testing different hot tubs is the key.

Happy Hot Tubbing....  

[Chris_H]

Sobe,
You make the best point out of every post in this thread.  Both brands make quality tubs, and both have excellent reputations.  You can’t go wrong with either.
Chris H

[Shut_Down_Stranger]

we went through a similar discussion when we wet tested spas, and you can throw the Marquis Reward into the mix.

we wound up with the grandee. Personally, I like the moto-massage, but also the other non-corner seats get as much if not more time in the grandee. Not that the moto massage is bad, but they are more functional than the seats in the optima.

another thing that influenced the decision was that the bench seats in the grandee were more accomodating for moving from seat to seat, and even turning sideways for a lounger effect. while  the optima seats were more deeply contoured "buckets" and less accomodating to conversation.  

Honestly, I think we would be happy with any of the tubs, but have no regrets with the choice of the grandee.

[Shut_Down_Stranger]

oh yeah... one other thing... beer holders...

verrrry important.....don't want to rech too far for the brew..

[IonHeaven]

Good point about the beer holders. I'll have to add that to my list of things to check out when I FINALLY get to wet test the Envoy I'm interested in tomorrow!

IonHeaven