Having a New Spa Custom built? Pumps, Jets, etc?

[Tman122]

Also If as far as pump/jet ratio would I need to use a quantity of jets that divide equally into the flow rate of the pump? say 25x 10 gpm jets for 1 250gpm pump or would the loss of flow in the plumbing mean that I should lower my jet numbers to pump ratio? If I were to utilize 25x 10 gpm jets and use a diverter valve to shut off roughly half of the jets to one seat would this strain the pump? Would this increase the pressure significantly now that the pump is trying to flow 250 gpm though 12 or 13 10gpm jets, etc...?

Yes friction loss is a factor. Calculating it is difficult but not impossible. Most quality manufacturers have done the testing and have the numbers. X amount of feet of tubing of each specific size, quantity of fittings, manifold loss, all these things have an effect on 250 GPM. You need a delivery and manifold system that covers the 250 both in suction and flow. Even though you will likely have less than 250 to work with from the manifold. Then your distribution from the manifold is where you start calculating loss and jet size. It's not easy. Some just wing it.

[amy2421]

For that kind of price, won't the dealer who is custom-building it be able to provide more help on the technical specifics of what works and how much you need?

[Hottubguy]

I work in the oil/gas and back in 2008 we had a downturn that hurt houston pretty bad. I was laid off for a year and lost my house. This tore up my credit and ive been piecing it back together ever since. I am not interested in playing the envy game but I have my parents (both with arthritis/rheumatoid) that will be in here all the time, as well as 4 sisters, 2 brother in laws, and multiple nieces/nephews. So size is really a big factor. The 16.5k for the Artesian Bimini is too much (but it does come with extended 5 year warranty, cover, steps, etc...). Ive heard of deals on here for much less though and the only dealer in town will not budge on the price. They are also overpriced on the Jacuzzi 495. actually its weird. All of the dealers Ive called locally seem to be overpriced compared to pricing ive seen on this board. I took the liberty of calling around 3 local spa repair guys and asked them about Accent custom spa's. They all said basically the same thing. The controls are dated, one guy went into detail about how he prefers the manual buttons and pneumatic switches over the LCD control boards. One guy mentioned that the s

Have you tried going to the dealer and negotiating. A lot of times when people call me for prices I shoot MSRP prices to give them a idea but tubs on my floor are quite a bit below MSRP. There is no way I would drop 11k on that tub. I would look at used options if financing is a issue

[p0opstlnksal0t]

I feel you poop, get what ever is right for you and the family. But these guys on here are very truthfull and their advice/opinions have proven true time and again. You can get a Paradise H2 right now for about $11k also. (At least in my area)  http://laspas.com/paradise-h2/   Nearst dealer to you is in Belton.
BLUE CREST POOLS & SPAS INC (153.98 mi / 247.81 km)
Address 1:   1404 N MAIN
City:   BELTON
State:   TX
Postal Code:   76513
Country:   USA
Phone:   (254) 939-8250

Maybe check them out. I know there are a couple H2 owners on this site who are very happy. The last thing you want is to be sitting in your new $11,000 tub wishing you got something different.

Good luck keep us posted.

Thanks for the tip! I really like the Paradise H2 but I do not like the dealer being 2+ hours away. let alone their reviews: http://www.yelp.com/biz/blue-crest-pools-and-spas-belton

It looks like that is the only place that sell LA spas nearby too.

I talked with w hot springs/D1 dealer yesterday and tried negotiating prices on a HS Gleam cheapest I could get was 16.5k WTF? and their D1 Amore Bay in stock is 14.5k.... I guess these houston dealers are all in bed with each other....

[p0opstlnksal0t]

For that kind of price, won't the dealer who is custom-building it be able to provide more help on the technical specifics of what works and how much you need?

Yes they have their own method... the engineer in me wants to improve upon it hahaha

Also If as far as pump/jet ratio would I need to use a quantity of jets that divide equally into the flow rate of the pump? say 25x 10 gpm jets for 1 250gpm pump or would the loss of flow in the plumbing mean that I should lower my jet numbers to pump ratio? If I were to utilize 25x 10 gpm jets and use a diverter valve to shut off roughly half of the jets to one seat would this strain the pump? Would this increase the pressure significantly now that the pump is trying to flow 250 gpm though 12 or 13 10gpm jets, etc...?

Yes friction loss is a factor. Calculating it is difficult but not impossible. Most quality manufacturers have done the testing and have the numbers. X amount of feet of tubing of each specific size, quantity of fittings, manifold loss, all these things have an effect on 250 GPM. You need a delivery and manifold system that covers the 250 both in suction and flow. Even though you will likely have less than 250 to work with from the manifold. Then your distribution from the manifold is where you start calculating loss and jet size. It's not easy. Some just wing it.

I cant find any documentation to show what the loss is utilizing these manifolds




I guess I could assume a rough 30% loss.... I think If I went with 3 pumps I would not want to use any diverter valves which would take away another 30% or so... maybe split each pump going to 2 seats.

The cluster storm jets are: ¼" Nozzle for 7 GPM @ 12 PSI flow rate
Mini storm and poly storm jets appear to flow the same (10gpm) with the difference being the bezel sizes i think...
Then there are the power storm jets which flow 12-18gpm

[Sam]

I agree that this sounds like a bad idea.  If you do go for it, skip the blower and air bubbles.  There is a reason none of the reputable manufacturers use them anymore.

[Sam]

Also, have you looked at the South Seas 965L by artesian?

http://www.southseasspas.com/content/spas/deluxe/965L.html

It should be less than the one you are looking at, but much higher quality.  You can also get it without all of the bells and whistles.  It's actually a great hot tub, imo.

[sksmoker]

Just food for thought. I bought our Coast Freedom "elite" model for $10,700 last Aug, and that is Canadian dollars..a fairly basic tub compared to others with no stereo equipment,etc.

If I paid that up here, with the exchange alone now, there should be a fairly sizable price difference on tubs in that range from various manufactuers?

[BullFrogSpasMN]

I feel you poop, get what ever is right for you and the family. But these guys on here are very truthfull and their advice/opinions have proven true time and again. You can get a Paradise H2 right now for about $11k also. (At least in my area)  http://laspas.com/paradise-h2/   Nearst dealer to you is in Belton.
BLUE CREST POOLS & SPAS INC (153.98 mi / 247.81 km)
Address 1:   1404 N MAIN
City:   BELTON
State:   TX
Postal Code:   76513
Country:   USA
Phone:   (254) 939-8250

Maybe check them out. I know there are a couple H2 owners on this site who are very happy. The last thing you want is to be sitting in your new $11,000 tub wishing you got something different.

Good luck keep us posted.

Thanks for the tip! I really like the Paradise H2 but I do not like the dealer being 2+ hours away. let alone their reviews: http://www.yelp.com/biz/blue-crest-pools-and-spas-belton

It looks like that is the only place that sell LA spas nearby too.

I talked with w hot springs/D1 dealer yesterday and tried negotiating prices on a HS Gleam cheapest I could get was 16.5k WTF? and their D1 Amore Bay in stock is 14.5k.... I guess these houston dealers are all in bed with each other....

some dealers do have the "buy it at my price or buy it somewhere else" attitude but if you walked in for a check for 15k for a Gleam I'd be shocked if they turned it down, although I think you can get a much better tub (not the same size obviously) but overall much better jetting from a different spa for less money imho

[Tman122]

For that kind of price, won't the dealer who is custom-building it be able to provide more help on the technical specifics of what works and how much you need?

Yes they have their own method... the engineer in me wants to improve upon it hahaha

Also If as far as pump/jet ratio would I need to use a quantity of jets that divide equally into the flow rate of the pump? say 25x 10 gpm jets for 1 250gpm pump or would the loss of flow in the plumbing mean that I should lower my jet numbers to pump ratio? If I were to utilize 25x 10 gpm jets and use a diverter valve to shut off roughly half of the jets to one seat would this strain the pump? Would this increase the pressure significantly now that the pump is trying to flow 250 gpm though 12 or 13 10gpm jets, etc...?

Yes friction loss is a factor. Calculating it is difficult but not impossible. Most quality manufacturers have done the testing and have the numbers. X amount of feet of tubing of each specific size, quantity of fittings, manifold loss, all these things have an effect on 250 GPM. You need a delivery and manifold system that covers the 250 both in suction and flow. Even though you will likely have less than 250 to work with from the manifold. Then your distribution from the manifold is where you start calculating loss and jet size. It's not easy. Some just wing it.

I cant find any documentation to show what the loss is utilizing these manifolds




I guess I could assume a rough 30% loss.... I think If I went with 3 pumps I would not want to use any diverter valves which would take away another 30% or so... maybe split each pump going to 2 seats.

The cluster storm jets are: ¼" Nozzle for 7 GPM @ 12 PSI flow rate
Mini storm and poly storm jets appear to flow the same (10gpm) with the difference being the bezel sizes i think...
Then there are the power storm jets which flow 12-18gpm

But none of your calculations will matter if it's to strong (hurts, makes you itchy) or to soft (does not do much) the only way to know is to feel it. You may like more or less flow.

[p0opstlnksal0t]

Well we ended up pulling the trigger on the custom. the pricing around here is just too high for a larger tub (J495, Gleam, Mirage, Serena Bay, Aspen, Bimini, etc... ) I visited multiple dealers here in Houston and pricing was nothing like what Ive been reading on the boards. Everything was 15.5k+

Anyways I went with Accent Outdoors homemade spa. Ill post updates as to quality and such once it comes in. I drilled them about plumbing, filtration, jets used, etc... I feel like we will be taken care of if something breaks as their customer service, BBB and online reviews are excellent. We may have overpaid for what we got but we got more of what we wanted vs the big guys tub's and got it for 5k cheaper...

[JustAnotherNewbie]

Congratulations,  now the hard part is waiting. Looking forward to updates and pics of that giant party tub in action!

[p0opstlnksal0t]

Will do. I know its probably not as nice as these big named guys tubs but it was exactly what we wanted (air controlled) simple effective easy to repair and was as big of a hot tub as we could possibly find for a decent deal. 11k with 5 year all parts warrantied and lifetime on the shell seems as good of a warranty as the others if they honor it. The good online reviews for this company are what allowed us to feel more comfortable about the purchase. This thing is essentially a deep bench seated tub as big as a swim spa.

[amy2421]

Will do. I know its probably not as nice as these big named guys tubs but it was exactly what we wanted (air controlled) simple effective easy to repair and was as big of a hot tub as we could possibly find for a decent deal. 11k with 5 year all parts warrantied and lifetime on the shell seems as good of a warranty as the others if they honor it. The good online reviews for this company are what allowed us to feel more comfortable about the purchase. This thing is essentially a deep bench seated tub as big as a swim spa.

How soon will it be ready?

[p0opstlnksal0t]

It will take about 2 weeks to build out. They're ordering all of the waterway parts monday. I'll update with pics and build quality pics when it gets delivered. I saw another one of there tubs guts. Appears they use about 3-4 in foam insulation under the shell. The plumbing is mostly open for ease of repairing. I personally didn't think full foam would benefit us much in the 9-10 months of houston heat.