Question for Spa Tech tuo

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Did Jim aka the spa deceptionist ever give you an answer regarding his latest court issue?

[Spatech_tuo]

His silence is enough of an answer. BTW, Eric has created his own site now to chronicle his spa purchase disaster and this time Jim can't cry to the site owner to remove it like he did previously.

http://www.selberg.org/homes/speed/spa.html

[Brewman]

Now he's bragging about a new truck he just bought.  
Apparently the financing must have not gone through Vectra Bank.  
Brewman

[doodoo]

Wow! every time I read one of these sites detailing a nightmaare story, I get a little nicer with my dealer at the next visit 'cause they are just superb at meeting my needs.

[rick]

I don't get it, or maybe I do.
If this guy is such a quack, why do you even give mention to him?  Why aren't you all just ignoring him as one should with any kook?
When I read more and more references to the spa specialist on these boards, it makes me wonder if the man may just be speaking some truth amongst his ranting and raving.  Again, I see you Indians circling the wagons anytime someone has the gall to talk down your product.  
When you keep trading barbs with the guy, you give him more credence.  
Just makes me believe more and more that you guys all share the same bed.  
You do a disservice to the spa shopping public.
And you demean yourselves by posting information about a man's legal problems.
I am by no means an ally of that guy, heck, he calls my Coleman spa crap too, but again, if you all keep reacting to what he's saying, you're telling everybody there's some validity to what he talks about.    
(begining to wonder if Watkins is the AntiChrist)  

Oh, don't forget people,  Wet Test, Wet Test, Wet Test.

[Mendocino101]

lol....Rick....I agree 100% with you......I thought the same thing about Watkins..... ...just teasing.........

[Lori]

Sorry, in my business, 3M is the anti-christ!!!

[Spa_Tech]

I think posts like these illustrate that the dealer is as important as the product when youre shopping for a hot tub.

Im sure there are many that would disagree with me when I say this,... as you can buy furniture or appliances or anything else out there without any after-the-sale support and be perfectly happy. But in my opinion, a specialty product like a spa needs someone trustworthy and experienced to provide the customer adequate support, even after money has changed hands.

Im curious Rick, dont you agree that if there was a problem with a particular brand of spa or a dealer who cannot keep his word, that anyone likely to run into them should know? I fail to see just how white-washing the negative experiences that people have had would help consumers make a well-reasoned decision... Or how airing the soiled laundry of an inconsiderate and self-righteous retailer would render them credible or trustworthy.

Jim isnt the only spa dealer out there with credibility and legal issues. There was also the incarcerated dealer from New Jersey who bilked his customers out of deposits for product he could not or would not deliver. The same for a man out of Florida, who sold spas out the back of a truck and at flea markets-- who was caught at the airport fleeing to his country of origin with customers deposits. In my area, there was a  Cal Spas dealer who had zero spa experience- opened a store and within a year, was closed again- incarcerated for spousal rape, kidnapping, and child endangerment.

Is the product so important that you can overlook the dealer altogether? No way.

Here are some questions shoppers should be asking themselves and of the retailers they are shopping;


How long has the dealer been in business? Do they feature their tenure, boasting being in business for 10,15,20,25 years?

Do they provide customer references? More than 5? 10?

How long have the dealers service people been servicing spas? How much training has everyone had? Accreditation?

Does the dealer service only the product they sell, or do they service all products?

Is the dealer an active member of industry organizations like NSPI, or groups like the BBB, or Chamber of Commerce, or other community involvement?

Is the dealer involved with any legal suits, including collections or leins against the proprietor? Have they filed for bankruptcy?

How much of their product is financed? (They likely wont answer this,... but Id ask anyway.)

Is the dealer consistantly mentioned when his competition is asked for a reliable second choice?

Has the dealer been in the newspaper? (Nexus searches can dig up both the good and bad.) Industry magazines?

Ultimately, the questions above may not bear fruit, but it doenst take long to do a little investigation to see how trustworthy a dealer is. If theres any doubt, listen to your gut. Caveat Emptor.

[stuart]

Hey I have a question, if Jim goes out of business due to financial issues, does phoenix take care of the warranty for the customers left in the wake? Not that he takes care of them now according to this link, (cut and paste it)
http://www.selberg.org/homes/speed/spa.html

My guess is that they would deny all claims due to his "modifications". Any thoughts?

[wmccall]

Sorry, in my business, 3M is the anti-christ!!!

For me its Dell, Microsoft, and everyother company sending our jobs to India.

[empolgation]

rick, you're making too much sense.
I'd be curious to know how many folks slamming him have had any kind of relationship with him other than bantering bouts...

[Tman122]

I have no relationship with Jim, other than him calling me an idiot like he does everyone else! I also have read his entire site and have never argued the fact that his ideas will work and they probably do, matter of fact my tub purchase was designed for me to modify and make better and more energy effiecient...and it worked! This based on his ideas and many others available to me in my trade (mechanical) But it's not his tubs...it's him and his attitude that bothers me. He needs some PR skills we all will agree.

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As Tman stated,the issues Jim has created over time have little to do with his mid-grade spa. As most will atest,it is his character,or lack there-of,and his abilty to deceive the weak and innocent.

Most people don't like being burned,that's a given. Jim has more than once burned his "former" customers,and it appears at this present time,he is renigging on a loan. I'm sure there's lots more going on that most are unaware of.

Case in point....he answered a few questions/statements on another spa message board,and all the while,ignored a post addressed especially to him.

As long as Jim and people like him are out there with his character traits,I will do my best to inform them of my opinions. I hate seeing people hustled/conned.

Freedom of speech works both ways Jimbo.....Most believe in telling the truth,maybe someday Jim will see the light?

[Maverick]

Regarding the "good dealer" issues, I agree with the points made. However, I would not want the quality of my spa service to fluctuate depending on the ups and downs of a small business operation.

Thus, I feel that it is even more important to have a relationship with the factory people behind the dealer. If my Catalina dealer moved on and was replaced with another person, or that sales outlet shut down, I wouldn't care less. Why? Because I established a relationship with some key people in the Catalina factory/headquarters before and immediately after buying my spa.

This is not an unusual situation. We drive Toyota products, and I am comforted greatly knowing that Toyota supports its customers fully even if the local dealer is , shall we say, less than cooperative.

Regarding that Colorado jury-rigged product, the dealer and the manufacturer is the same one-man band, and one can only guess what stands behind him, if anyone or anything.

Woe be to his customers if he is run over by his new truck or just continues to flagellate himself to pieces.

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Does anyone know where this issue stands? Was it settled,How much did Jim pay etc?