Clearwater Spas?

[mrmojo1111]

Hi everyone! New to the forum and hot tubs in general. I've been shopping around for a big (7+ person) tub and have found a few that I like. The local market is somewhat limited. There is a Hot Springs dealer, and we really like the Grandee. We were interested in the Gleam due to its size and features, but our dealer doesn't stock them, as he claims they are too big for his limited showroom space. There is a Bullfrog dealer, another guy sells Baja spas, and then finally, a dealer that sells Nordic and Clearwater. We like the size and open layout of the Clearwater xs93nl. Haven't read much on here about Clearwater. Anyone have any experience with these or any impressions about their quality. Seems like they will be about 5 K chapter than a comparable Hot Spring. I assume the Hot Springs is the better tub. Am I correct? Is it 5 K better? Should I be looking at other brands, even if I have to shop out of town?  Thanks in advance for any advice! Nick.

[dunecritter]

Welcome to the Forum Nick, I have been a spa owner for over 20 plus years and have enjoyed them all...Some more than others but still enjoyed them. I have recently started selling Hot Spring spas this year and own a 2014 Grandee myself. On my showroom floor I have a wet test room that has 5 models to try ( TX, Bolt, Tempo, Grande NXT, and a Gleam) Last week after work I sat in all 5 so I personally had my own review on each model to better describe the sensation one could expect from them if they tried it or not. To try and give you some input I'll stick to the Grandee and the Gleam as these are the two I have experience with out of the ones you have mentioned.

The Grandee is top notch in pretty much every way from fit and finish, Stylish looks, Wireless RF controller that even my 3 year old can operate and a very powerful yet comfortable seating arrangement. The Grandee is very comfortable and quiet operation. The seats are very roomy and large giving you plenty of room between you and others without feeling like your rubbing legs and playing footsy with others. It is described as a 7 person tub but when you look at the actual seating it seats 6 in designated seats.

The Gleam is just massive...It has LOTS of power and is also loaded with whistles and bells but the Lighting is not as fancy as the Grandee and has a traditional digital topside controller that is a little more intense to navigate around options and features. The tub is also a little louder in operation as the insulation is different and the tub boasts 4 pumps (3 main and one circ). I personally enjoy lounge seats as I had a HS Vista model for 7 years but has been discontinued for 2014. The Lounge is very large in the gleam and I don't fit it well at all...So I personally did not care for it.
 You are doing the right thing by looking at all your options and there are a lot of options with many manufactures. Just because one person thinks that the best tub is "XYZ" it may not be right for you. The best tub for me is one that first of all has a good warranty backed by a reputable manufacture that has many years to back it up and looks good and feels good. Unfortunately all tubs feel different and the best feeling tub could be a not so good of product and vise versa...Find a manufacture you feel confident in owning and make sure that you like and trust the dealer that locally sells that product <----VERY IMPORTANT! and once you have found that I recommend finding a tub from that supplier that best fits you budget and your butt! My $.02. Others might disagree in that logic and that's ok.
I have never owned any of the other brands you have mentioned so I will not comment on those.  But Hot Spring is one of the best options you have mentioned.

[mrmojo1111]

Well, I visited my local HS dealer for the third time yesterday, and let's just say that the experience has not been positive. The first two times I went there, the only salesperson available was, by his own admission, a "new" employee that didn't know much about the products. This time, nobody came to help me for 15 minutes, and all they had on display was a smaller model and a 2013 leftover Grandee which was cold, smelled funky (like an old used dishrag), and marked "On Clearance" for 14K! Needless to say, not a very good impression. So, I am considering shopping around out of town, although that is less than ideal. Looking at Sundance and Jacuzzi dealers about an hour away. Also revisiting the local Bullfrog option, although I was less than enthusiastic about it initially. Seems as though there is not much experience here with Clearwater, so I'm not terribly excited about that option either. Wouldn't have thought it would be this hard to buy a tub with what I felt was a fairly generous budget at my disposal!

[Chartreux]

I've had the same type dealing with BullFrog so stay away from them, However, Sundance has been very pleasant so I would suggest you look at those, and since I do not have a nearby Marquis I might have to try them sometime. I like the Spirit and wonder if it has the Microsilk...So far the most knowledgable and nicest shops has been the Sundance (even if they are owned by Jacuzzi).
I just hope Marquis dealer will be knowledgable. Arctic has been nice very nice online but when I ask if they have a dealer around me I get no reply, They have a listing for my area but no address...but they have been nice...
Others will comeby with their advise of course...But I'm not a dealer, so this is my opinions...

[Lionheart_CHP]

MrMojo,

Not sure exactly where you are but it sounds like you're in the Tampa Bay area.  I was very happy dealing with Brian at the Bullfrog dealer on Hwy 60 in Brandon.  He was very helpful and attentive.  There's a place across the street on 60 that sells Caldera.  The guy was nice enough, but a bit used car sales-ish  The Hot Springs dealer on Nebraska Ave in Tampa "Mr. Pool" was not a place I'd consider spending this kind of money.  From your description I'd bet that's where you went.  I wound up at the Jacuzzi dealer in Lakeland, buying a Sunrise S104.  The Bullfrog place on 60 also sells Sunrise, but the Lakeland dealer is closer and gave me a better price.

I hope this helps some.

[Hottubguy]

I've had the same type dealing with BullFrog so stay away from them, However, Sundance has been very pleasant so I would suggest you look at those, and since I do not have a nearby Marquis I might have to try them sometime. I like the Spirit and wonder if it has the Microsilk...So far the most knowledgable and nicest shops has been the Sundance (even if they are owned by Jacuzzi).
I just hope Marquis dealer will be knowledgable. Arctic has been nice very nice online but when I ask if they have a dealer around me I get no reply, They have a listing for my area but no address...but they have been nice...
Others will comeby with their advise of course...But I'm not a dealer, so this is my opinions...




The spirit does have the micro silk as an option

[Sam]

I've had the same type dealing with BullFrog so stay away from them, However, Sundance has been very pleasant so I would suggest you look at those, and since I do not have a nearby Marquis I might have to try them sometime. I like the Spirit and wonder if it has the Microsilk...So far the most knowledgable and nicest shops has been the Sundance (even if they are owned by Jacuzzi).
I just hope Marquis dealer will be knowledgable. Arctic has been nice very nice online but when I ask if they have a dealer around me I get no reply, They have a listing for my area but no address...but they have been nice...
Others will comeby with their advise of course...But I'm not a dealer, so this is my opinions...

You do know that hot tub dealers are independent?  Just because he had a bad experience with a Hot Spring dealer does not all represent all HS dealers.  The same with your Bullfrog experience.  I will say though that a good dealer is very important.

As to Clearwater, I have quite a bit of experience with them.  I think they have the strongest shell in the industry.  They certainly have the best shell warranty, 20 years structure and surface.  They are also one of the companies that does thermal pane insulation the right way.  Very energy efficient and easy access for repairs.  The XS93NL is a good tub.  Nothing flashy about it, but a solid tub with good jetting.  The Grandee is certainly a nicer tub.  Is it $5k nicer?  That's tough to say.  $5k is a lot.

[Chartreux]

Yes, I do know they are independent, 2 different Bullfrog dealers and both bad experiences....

[mrmojo1111]

Well, I went ahead and took a closer look at Bullfrog. The dealer only had an A7 on display, but I really liked what I saw! They did give me the high pressure sales treatment, saying they were about to restock their showroom, and if I ordered now I could get a discount based on cheaper overall shipping. However, she also said the A8 was their fastest seller, so I'm sure they are going to order one anyway. They gave me a quote of 12.4K if ordered now, or 13K otherwise. Going to look at Jacuzzi and Sundance tonight. Checked out another Hot Springs dealer in another town. They also did not stock the Gleam, but gave me a quote of 12.5K for a non-NXT Grandee. They were more helpful in 5 minutes over the phone than three visits to the other dealer! Eager to offer a wet test on any model in their stock at anytime with a little notice so they could be sure to have it full and warm. Hopefully we'll be able to narrow it down to 3 or 4 tubs, then test each one and decide from there.

By the way, I'm in central Illinois. Do these seem like decent prices? Since these are the opening offers, I figured there would still be some room to negotiate. Would love to be closer to 10-11K! (Before I began shopping and had no idea how much these things cost, I planned to spend around 10K).

Thanks to everyone for your input!

Nick

[Chartreux]

See about doing a wet tests to make sure you get the right spa for you, then maybe  see if they can give it to you for $11,000...It's really hard to negotiate. But if you have a fixed price in mind might not hurt to ask. Good luck to you...

[Hottubguy]

Yes, I do know they are independent, 2 different Bullfrog dealers and both bad experiences....

It's funny how the dealer itself can skew ones opinion of a particular brand. Within a hour- hour and a half of me there is 2 dealers for bullfrog and 2 dealers for hot spring. 1 of the bullfrog dealers and 1 of the hot spring dealers are detested by a lot of people so when they come in to see what I have they already have a bad taste in their mouths about those particular brands. The other 2 I hate going against because I know they are top notch companies who represent the brand well so people who go in to see them generally like what they have seen. That's why a dealer is sometimes more important then the brand

[mrmojo1111]

Update: Just got home from the Jacuzzi/Sundance dealer. Dealer made a great impression as did the J495! What an impressive tub! Massive, aesthetically pleasing, perfect layout for my tastes, nice set of features, only one problem...price. MSRP just south of 19K, "sale" price just south of 16K. The salesman said he could give me a "cash deal" of 13.3K, including "upgraded" cover and lifter, composite steps, JBL sound system. So, this feels like a pretty good deal, but over the initial arbitrary budget by a third!

I am now down to a four horse race between A8, Grandee, J495, and Clearwater XS93NL. I know, one of these things is not like the other. Obviously, the Clearwater is a step down in class, but it is big enough for our needs, and would be far cheaper. I get a very good vibe from the dealer, and they seem well made, just low on features. Tough decision. I'll have to schedule some wet tests!

All things ($) being equal, which tub would you choose between the first three? Why?

Nick

[Sam]

Update: Just got home from the Jacuzzi/Sundance dealer. Dealer made a great impression as did the J495! What an impressive tub! Massive, aesthetically pleasing, perfect layout for my tastes, nice set of features, only one problem...price. MSRP just south of 19K, "sale" price just south of 16K. The salesman said he could give me a "cash deal" of 13.3K, including "upgraded" cover and lifter, composite steps, JBL sound system. So, this feels like a pretty good deal, but over the initial arbitrary budget by a third!

I am now down to a four horse race between A8, Grandee, J495, and Clearwater XS93NL. I know, one of these things is not like the other. Obviously, the Clearwater is a step down in class, but it is big enough for our needs, and would be far cheaper. I get a very good vibe from the dealer, and they seem well made, just low on features. Tough decision. I'll have to schedule some wet tests!

All things ($) being equal, which tub would you choose between the first three? Why?

Nick

You are looking at Clearwater's entry level tub.  If you look at their Beachcraft series, you will see a lot more features.  Look at the Tradition.  It is the same size as the xs93NL and has no lounger, but a lot more features.  It should fall right around your target budget. 

That being said, you are looking at a lot of other really nice hot tubs.  I would be partial to the A8 personally, but I am a Bullfrog fanboy.  I really believe in the design, as well as the company and their culture.  Honestly, I don't think you can go wrong with any of the choices that you listed.

Good luck!

[petals20]

Update: Just got home from the Jacuzzi/Sundance dealer. Dealer made a great impression as did the J495! What an impressive tub! Massive, aesthetically pleasing, perfect layout for my tastes, nice set of features, only one problem...price. MSRP just south of 19K, "sale" price just south of 16K. The salesman said he could give me a "cash deal" of 13.3K, including "upgraded" cover and lifter, composite steps, JBL sound system. So, this feels like a pretty good deal, but over the initial arbitrary budget by a third!

I am now down to a four horse race between A8, Grandee, J495, and Clearwater XS93NL. I know, one of these things is not like the other. Obviously, the Clearwater is a step down in class, but it is big enough for our needs, and would be far cheaper. I get a very good vibe from the dealer, and they seem well made, just low on features. Tough decision. I'll have to schedule some wet tests!

All things ($) being equal, which tub would you choose between the first three? Why?

Nick

You are looking at Clearwater's entry level tub.  If you look at their Beachcraft series, you will see a lot more features.  Look at the Tradition.  It is the same size as the xs93NL and has no lounger, but a lot more features.  It should fall right around your target budget. 

+1...I can't even begin to say how very true that statement it. For some reason they have a budget & deluxe package or line in each series. I.E,..just like under the Honda accord line it has 3 series EX, LX, DX. Clear water has an XS line with a Signature series that is such a big bump in finish & #jets from the lesser Gold series it's ridiculous. Notice how proficient I am with the models when one spends all day researching. 


A picture can say a 1000 words right?..well here it is for your eyes only. One quick glance & there's no doubt as to which is the higher series. In fact it doesn't even look like it's from the same mfg. Ok so now do you see why after countless hours on the net I brushed off all the other big names like Hot Springs & Bull Frog after another member from this very same forum brought up Clearwater so one look & I was hooked line & sinker as you big boys would say.

[mrmojo1111]

Yeah, my dealer had a bunch of the traditions line tubs on the floor. To me, they seemed tacky, plasticky, over-featured, over-jetted (only my personal perception, take it FWIW). We really are looking for a large, relatively open layout, hence the interest in the ZS93. Yes, it is a more "basic" model, and at roughly 9K, is priced as such. Unfortunately, I don't think it has made the cut.

In our final three are the A8, J495, and Grandee (NXT version). We wet tested an A7 today, and really liked the feel of the seats and quality of hydrotherapy from several of the jet packs. Not sure if the size of the A8 is quite enough, though. Now that we have seen the J495, everything else seems small by comparison!