Best alternative to chlorine/bromine? Any suggestions

[Johnnyjet]

I have no allergies just remember the smell of the chlorine and how it bleaches so I was wondering does anyone use an alternative

[chem geek]

Do you remember the smell and bleaching from commercial/public spas?  They generally don't use Cyanuric Acid (CYA) in the water and that has the chlorine be much, much stronger so outgases faster which is why you smell it much more and it also oxidizes swimsuits, skin and hair faster.  They also tend to keep the chlorine level higher, sometimes as high as 5 ppm, and maintain it higher during your soak.

This is not how you would be using chlorine in your own residential hot tub.  You would most likely be using Dichlor or perhaps the Dichlor-then-bleach method, but either way you will have CYA in the water that significantly moderates chlorine's strength so it should outgas less.  Also, most people start their soak with 1-2 ppm FC so there will be a limited amount of smell from chloramine (mostly monochloramine) and is about the same amount as is found in most tap water.

[Johnnyjet]

Okay. That's sounds reasonable.   I was looking I to the Clearwater blue product line but it's seems a little pricy

[Tman122]

Okay. That's sounds reasonable.   I was looking I to the Clearwater blue product line but it's seems a little pricy

Clearwater Blue is not an approved sanitizer and will require chlorine or bromine to sanitize your water. You will find that non chlorine shock will not be enough unless your bather load is very low and you go in freshly showered.

[chem geek]

If you plan to use the tub every day or two then chlorine may work for you.  If you will only use the tub infrequently, say only on weekends or even less, then bromine might be better as you could then use bromine tabs in a floating feeder and if you have an ozonator then it can make more bromine from a bromide bank.  There are also saltwater chlorine generators such as ControlOMatic TechniChlor but your spa needs to be able to handle the higher (2000 ppm) salt level.

[tobber]

I have a tub since 4 weeks, so not yet an experienced user.

I use the sundance sunpurity (ie the same as zodiac nature2) system and i think it is great untill now.
It is a miniral cartridge which you use in combination with MPS (like Leisure Time renew).
Chlorine you use only at the start and as needed when the water looks like it needs it.
We soak every day, and i still haven't used any chlorine and the water looks crystal clear and feels perfect, no dry skin/red eyes afterwards.
Our hottub supllier was not aware of this system because for some reason here in Europe it isn't sold but he was also amazed when he saw our water quality during his visit yesterday.

I only put MPS in the water after soaking, and that's it. So, very happy with the system!
I found out that it is really very important to keep the PH in good values, and the only way to do that is with a digital PH meter.

goodluck

[Tman122]

I have a tub since 4 weeks, so not yet an experienced user.

I use the sundance sunpurity (ie the same as zodiac nature2) system and i think it is great untill now.
It is a miniral cartridge which you use in combination with MPS (like Leisure Time renew).
Chlorine you use only at the start and as needed when the water looks like it needs it.
We soak every day, and i still haven't used any chlorine and the water looks crystal clear and feels perfect, no dry skin/red eyes afterwards.
Our hottub supllier was not aware of this system because for some reason here in Europe it isn't sold but he was also amazed when he saw our water quality during his visit yesterday.

I only put MPS in the water after soaking, and that's it. So, very happy with the system!
I found out that it is really very important to keep the PH in good values, and the only way to do that is with a digital PH meter.

goodluck

Be careful, how your water looks has nothing to do with bacteria.

[Isaac-1]

Like Tman says how the water looks does not tell you about dangers of bacteria.  This is one of the big dangers of so called alternative sanitizers, they may kill algae  (or prevent it from growing) which you can see, but do nothing to prevent the growth of dangerous bacteria which is much more difficult to detect.  When using Chlroine or Bromine, lack of algae is a good visual indicator that you have enough sanitizer in the water to also kill the hard to see bacteria.

[rosewoodsteel]

What is wrong with a green tub?
I plan to power my hot tub with the new solar panels and windmill I installed, last Spring.
No harsh chemicals for me, either.  I read a study that their use contributes to global warming.
100 freshwater clams will be filtering the water in my tub.
As a perk, we will be having a clam bake once or twice a year once they start multiplying.

[tobber]

Like Tman says how the water looks does not tell you about dangers of bacteria.  This is one of the big dangers of so called alternative sanitizers, they may kill algae  (or prevent it from growing) which you can see, but do nothing to prevent the growth of dangerous bacteria which is much more difficult to detect.  When using Chlroine or Bromine, lack of algae is a good visual indicator that you have enough sanitizer in the water to also kill the hard to see bacteria.

As far as i know is the zodiac nature2/MPS methode one of the few EPA approved sanitizing methods? I guess then it should be safe? (in contrast with all the alternative sanitizers on the market).

[Jacuzzi Jim]

Like Tman says how the water looks does not tell you about dangers of bacteria.  This is one of the big dangers of so called alternative sanitizers, they may kill algae  (or prevent it from growing) which you can see, but do nothing to prevent the growth of dangerous bacteria which is much more difficult to detect.  When using Chlroine or Bromine, lack of algae is a good visual indicator that you have enough sanitizer in the water to also kill the hard to see bacteria.

As far as i know is the zodiac nature2/MPS methode one of the few EPA approved sanitizing methods? I guess then it should be safe? (in contrast with all the alternative sanitizers on the market).

  It's all fun and games till you get the rash, then you might change your mind about using a bit of chlorine!          And you should really never get algae in your spa,  unless you leave your cover off in the summer with no sanitizer.   

[chem geek]

Yes, Nature² with MPS is an EPA-approved disinfectant for spas only (it requires hot water temperatures and does not kill quickly enough in cooler pool water temperature).  So that is a reasonable alternative to chlorine or bromine (sorry I forgot to mention that).  There's also Baquacil/biguanide/PHMB that is EPA-approved, but it's expensive and has it's own set of issues, but I thought I'd mention it for completeness.

As for global warming, chlorine and bromine do not contribute to it.  You are probably mixing up thinking of ozone depletion from chlorofluorocarbons (CFCs).  That is very different.  Chlorine and bromine are much, much more reactive than CFCs so if any outgas from a pool or spa they react with contaminants in the air or get broken down by sunlight long before they get higher in the atmosphere.  With CFCs those are different since they are much longer lived so can rise into the stratosphere where they then break down in the more intense sunlight and then cause problems.  See this link for a decent summary about this topic.  The chlorine they refer to is that created when the long-lived chlorinated compounds get into the stratosphere.

[Tman122]

I think he was screwing with chem geek. The instructions for N2/MPS specifically say add chlorine.

[chem geek]

Actually, the Nature² Spa Mineral Sanitizer Owner's Manual only requires chlorine 1) for superoxidizing after installing the cartridge in order to get it started and 2) as needed "to remedy problems which may occur when bathing loads are high, when successive MPS2 test strip reading indicate high demand, when water appears hazy or dull, when unpleasant odors or eye irritation occur, after heavy wind and rainstorms or if foam develops."  The "Low-Chlorine Recipe" uses only MPS before (if needed) and after each soak.  In practice, with this system people usually use chlorine about once a week or two to keep the water clear.

Though one can use only chlorine if one wants to, most people use MPS because they buy the Nature² so that they can soak without chlorine and use less chlorine.

The reason that silver ions with MPS can pass the stringent EPA DIS/TSS-12 laboratory test is probably due to the creation of divalent silver as described in this post.  MPS by itself even at hot spa temperatures wouldn't have quite the kill rates needed to pass the test on its own.

[tobber]

thanks, and as far i can say it works perfect (i also tested the water with the watersafe bacteria testkit).

The only thing what wonders me how to handle when i don't use the tub for some time. If you go on holiday for 3 weeks or even if you don't use it for a week.
If you take the manual literal, then you don't need to do anything during that time (except PH & alk but they are very stable)
Only when you enter the tub again, then you should take care of the MPS level.

Are the silver ions alone enough when you stay away for some time? And, if so, is it okay to lower the temperature when you are not around?