Silk Balance....is it worth it?

[hottub63]

Ok, I've read a million reviews on line about Silk Balance. The dealer swears by using Silk Balance, the silver ions, and the enhanced shock. He says I wouldn't need any sanitizer becuase the ozone and the ions would take care of that..

Thoughts?

By the way I just purchased a 2007 Hot Spring Envoy. This is our first hot tub and I'm trying to wrap my mind around the water maintenance.

Thanks!

[Flyonthewall]

in the silk balance brochure they recommend 1 tablespoon of chlorine per week.  some people go without it, but its probably not advisable.  the product isn't for everyone, but i for 1 am amazed at the amount of people that use it dilligently and swear by it.  if you go with it you will need to flush your spa thoroughly before starting. 
the makers of silk offer a no question money back guarantee on the 1st bottle.  if you are willing to hold them to that then why not try it?

[hottub63]

Thanks, my local dealer said that I could switch over to silk balance without having to drain my tub without a problem. No?

[Flyonthewall]

not according to the silk people.  the flush is crucial.  the silk is supposed to coat the pipes, inhibiting the forming of future biofilm.  all existing biofilm must be removed 1st.

[hottub63]

I actually bought a bag of the silk fresh start to do a flush on the used hot tub I just bought as suggested by the local dealer. He said as long as I did that I could switch to silk in a few months or so if I wanted to. No?

[chem geek]

Silk Balance is not a disinfectant.  It inhibits biofilm formation.  It won't kill the fecal and other bacteria that you shed, but if those bacteria aren't able to find surfaces to cling to then they won't replicate readily.  So obviously there won't be any protection for preventing person-to-person transmission of disease (bacteria, viruses, protozoa), but there may be some prevention of uncontrolled bacterial growth.  Dosing with chlorine once a week for sure won't last the entire week.

In a list of hot tub itch/rash/lung incidents I compiled on another forum, some "alternative" treatments showed up such as AquaFinesse when chlorine wasn't used, though Silk Balance wasn't on the list.  Nevertheless, because it operates in the same way, I'd just keep that in mind.  Note that since these products don't oxidize bather waste, they really need to be used in spas with ozonators.  Without an ozonator, you'll just be soaking in your own sweat and urine.  Of course, many skin products contain urea 

[hottub63]

Thanks for the feedback. This is my first hot tub and I'm trying to learn all I can.

So would you say skip the silk balance system?

Also how long does the ozone last in the hot spring spa? I actually had one dealer tell me it lasted over 10 years. Then one today me it only lasts 5 years and needs to be replaced every 5 years.

Just curious if that's true or not. How would a person ever know of the right amount of ozone is going into the spa? (Or any at all?)

Also what about the silver ion sticks? Are those nessecerily or are they gimmicks? Do they actually do anything? Do they work in connection with silk balance (our local hot springs dealer charges 200 dollars for a bottle of silk balance and an ion stick. He said they work together.

I know they claim to put "silver ions" into the water, but what does "silver ions" really do? Lol. Is it a gimmick? Do I use them if I don't use silk balance? What about ozone? Do I use them if I use or don't use ozone?

I'm a bit confused what all this does. Ozone. Silver ion. Silk vs no silk, etc.

Thanks for your help!

[chem geek]

I don't know how long ozonators last, but from what I've seen from reports on forums it sure doesn't seem like 10 years -- more like 3-5 at best, but I could be wrong.  You can readily tell if an ozonator is working and outputting reasonable amounts of ozone because the chlorine demand will be about double (50% loss over 24 hours instead of 25% loss) or so with no bather load and about half with bather load.

Ozone: kills most everything, but only what circulates through the ozonator so does nothing to bacteria or other pathogens stuck to spa surfaces.  Generally there isn't much ozone getting into the spa because if it did then there is risk of outgassing and ozone is an EPA-regulated air contaminant (and you'd smell it).  So usually you think of an ozonator as supplemental oxidation to help get rid of bather waste.  Interestingly, ozone does virtually nothing to ammonia, but it does oxidize monochloramine so ozone by itself isn't as good as ozone with chlorine (which you really need to handle the bulk spa water anyway).

Silver ions: kills bacteria including fecal bacteria, but somewhat slowly.  So not fast enough for the EPA to call it a disinfectant by itself, however when used in conjunction with non-chlorine shock (MPS) then this is approved by the EPA, at least for the Nature2 product (the EPA only approves products, not chemicals by themselves).  Nature2 is silver ions (and zinc) used with MPS you add yourself.  If you want an EPA-approved mostly non-chlorine system, then that would be the one.

Silk balance: inhibits biofilm formation, but does not directly kill bacteria.  It is not a disinfectant.  I'd only use this system if you also had an ozonator (otherwise you'd need to use chlorine to oxidize bather waste, or perhaps MPS regularly and then with chlorine once a week or so).  If you want to throw in silver ions into the mix, then at least you get some slow bacteria killing.

As for costs, the lowest cost would be the Dichlor-then-bleach method, but you have to know what you are doing to use that method.  As for what you should choose, it's your spa and you can choose what you want.  The above information is just to help you make your own informed decision.

[hottub63]

Thanks for your help. I'm assuming since my ozone is over 5 years old (it's a hot springs envoy tub) it's going to need to be replaced. I'm not really wanting to spend 300 bucks to replace that right now.

So with that being said what is my next option? Is ther a "preferred" method that people use or is it all across the board? I'm trying to wrap my mind around all of this.

Also once I fill my tub up for the first time how long will it be before I can get in? (Apart from the time it takes for the water to heat up?)

Do I have to wait a long time to get in agree putting in chemicals?

[chem geek]

If you are asking what surveys show how people maintain the hot tubs, the answer is that roughly 55% use chlorine, 35% use bromine, 10% use other systems including minerals (e.g. Nature2) and other systems.  For chlorine, Dichlor is the most common by far.

Yes, after you balance the chemicals in your spa you can go in right away, unless you did some sort of super-chlorination in which case you'll need to wait for the disinfectant levels to drop (or add something to drop them faster).

Just because your ozonator is older doesn't mean it's not working.  I wouldn't assume that and you should just see.

[hottub63]

Thanks for your help. I"m new to all of this and trying to figure it all out.

I have a can of enhanced shock that my local hot springs dealer sold me...I'm just ran the fresh clean and am going to drain and fill my hot tub this afternoon. After I do that the local dealer said to put in some enhanced shock and go from there. Does this sound right? What is enhanced shock? Is it sanitizer?

Also my "silver ion stick" that goes in the gray filter area on my Hot Springs hot tub needs to be replaced (I just bought this hot tub used...so I have no idea how long he has had it) do those sticks actually do anything? It looks like the local dealer wants you to spend 39 bucks or so on one every 4 months. Are they worth it?

[chem geek]

What do the ingredients say on the Enhanced Shock?  If it's dichloro-s-triazinetrione, then that's Dichlor which is chlorine.  If it says potassium monopersulfate, then that's non-chlorine shock (MPS) which is not a disinfectant by itself, but is with silver ions as in the Nature2 system.

If you are going to use chlorine and properly maintain your spa with chlorine then there is no need for the silver ions.  The silver ions are best used if you are going with the Nature2 system where you also use MPS.  It's a mostly non-chlorine approach.

[Flyonthewall]

like chem said, the ozone machine could be fine, or not.  there are test kits available.  here is one.  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Spa-Ozone-Detection-Tester-Kit-Hot-Tub-Ozonator-Test-/330875858736?
silk definitely needs the ozone and silver to work correctly.  using it in the showroom i witnessed the chlorine in it's tub last 2 to 3 times longer than in tubs maintained with dichlor only. 
the enhanced shock might be the new leisure time product, replenish.  it is an 85/15 mps to chlorine blend.  a good mix to go after body waste immediatly after soaking.

[hottub63]

@Chemgeek - The enhanced shock is made by Spa Guard...it says it is Sodium dichloro-s-triazinetrione and also says "oxidizer" below "spa guard" at the top. The dealer (a HUGE hot spring dealer in the Dallas area) told me pretty much all the Hot Springs customers use this, the Freshwater AG+ silver ion stick, and the onze system that's in the hot springs hot tub. He said to put in two cap fulls once a week and other than that everything should be good. Especially if I am changing out that Freshwater AG sivler ion stick out every 4 months. He said this is the very best way to go.

Is he wrong? He sounds like he knew what he was talking about and is a big dealer here. What are your thoughts?

[hottub63]

I just called my local store to tell them about this post, and he said the enhanced shock is only 58.2% sodium dishloro-s-triazinetrione and only about 46% active, so it's a much lower dose of chlorine. He said I could do one cap ful on a Sunday and another on a Wednesday and just sort of spread it out like that instead of once a week. He said normal chlorine is about 99%, so this is not the same and is meant to work well with the Ion Stick I bought and ozone.

Thoughts?