General > Beating a dead horse
full foam vs thermopannels
Hillbilly Hot Tub:
I was wrong, Clearwater does not spray, nor do they use bubblewrap. It is a 2 inch thick foam that they use for floating islands, and in construction. It has borates infused into the foam to eliminate bugs and rodents. It is foiled on both sides. It is placed on the floor and on all 4 walls of the cabinet, All 5 pieces touching tightly together. We brought it to an insulation guy(not a spa industry guy) and he stated it had an R 50 factor.....now that does not mean the tub as a whole is R 50, so lets not start down that road.
My point I guess is that a dead air space...a tight one with no gaps....with a high quality high R factor insulation works great. Add a 5 inch 2 pound quality cover.... My tub is very effcient. Why waste the heat pumps produce. I have 5 pumps and the other night, 50 degrees outside and all pumps going, my tub heated up 2 degrees in less than an hour from the heat produced by the pumps, heater never came on.
I had a full foam tub, a hawkeye and it cost me much more to run. The cabinet was always warm to the touch. Once you heat the foam up till it reaches the outside of the cabinet it starts "leaking out, kind of like a coffee cup. Now if the cabinet was lined with the foil to reflect the heat back, then filled with foam I think it would be great for insulation purposes.
Still have my gripes about repairs, I guess we have been the unlucky ones that have worked on all the full foam tubs with leaks other than in the control box. We have done a ton of them, multiple brands.
A quality tub is a quality tub....the high end tubs all seem to cost about the same to run, full foam or not, it just depends on how they are built
Tom:
--- Quote ---My point I guess is that a dead air space...a tight one with no gaps....with a high quality high R factor insulation works great. Add a 5 inch 2 pound quality cover.... Why waste the heat pumps produce. (My emphasis - TG)
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An excellent brief summary of the benefits of perimeter insulation. Conserving energy from the pumps has been part of our system since 1997 (we call it "Free Heat(tm)")
BauerN:
I always tell myself: "I'm just gonna look at BADH, I won't post, I won't post, I..."
I can't resist pointing this out though. (Even though I sell and service FF spas).
The reason (IMO), that Arctic is doing a much better job than any others (which I'm aware of), was stated earlier, sort of.
Heat will, like many things, follow the path of least resistance. So, by putting the high R-value foam on the cabinet, and not much on the shell, the least resistance is toward the plumbing and shell (where your water is). This will effectively recycle the heat from pumps.
Other TP brands I have worked on put more insulation on the shell than the cabinet, therefore making the recycling aspect less effective (least resistance becomes outside of the spa).
I hope I don't ruffle too many feathers with this part:
I live in Montana, it gets kinda cold here (if you've never visited). The ONLY TP spa I would consider at this point is Arctic.
Hillbilly Hot Tub:
Clearwater does not put insulation on the shell either. My point is there are a few good TP companies which have their other advantages.
It still all comes down to quality building and service. Not all in how many can we sell, but how many customers are completely happy.
I live in NH, also very cold as with Washington where Clearwater is made, and Canada for Artic who has all of us beat on "coldness" :D (I went on vacation to the coast of Canada in August and froze my butt off!)
BauerN:
--- Quote ---Clearwater does not put insulation on the shell either. My point is there are a few good TP companies which have their other advantages.
It still all comes down to quality building and service. Not all in how many can we sell, but how many customers are completely happy.
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I'm in complete agreement with both of these points.
I have zero exposure to Clearwater, please pardon me for leaving them out.
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