Welcome to our forum.
Please forgive any tone.
In point #2 you mentioned that your facility is CEC certified? How does that work? Does the California Energy Commission come to the facility in Canada? Will you have facility certified by Oregon and NJ when they enact similar standards?
Will the CEC verify this certification for a consumer?
Lastly, there is a rather extensive list of Hot Tub manufacturers and related industries, with the help of ASAP, that have joined together to work with the CEC in effort to make any transition as easy as it can be for the industry. The contributions from these industry leaders have been financial as well as advisory. As an industry leader, is Artic involved with this?
Dear Steve, I'm sorry if my line of questioning seems intense. I am, after all, asking questions about Arctic, in a thread titled Ask an Artic Dealer anything. Intensity aside, if my questions are too tough, inappropriate or rude, please let me know.
I'll be happy to answer your Caldera questions to the best of my ability.
As far as Caldera Energy Efficiency Studies I’ll offer this and I am sure many of the other Watkins Dealers in the forum would agree.I am sure there are volumes of testing data and research information locked snuggly in the vaults of Watkins Mfg in southern Calif. I have no doubt that there is no other spa manufacturer out there that does as much R/D on a product as Watkins.
I also know the research is expensive and proprietary. I can not imagine that you, or I, or anyone else would have an easy time getting our hands on the data.
I prefer a simpler testing method for Caldera in my area. I ask my Caldera clients how much it costs to run their spa when they visits my store.
I also have faith in Watkins that when these mandated energy standards go into effect, Caldera will pass with flying colors.
I am sorry these questions seem tough. I sell hottubs, but I am also a citizen. It was earth day yesterday and the price of oil hit $119 a barrel.
Again, Caldera and every other major line of spas all operate within a few bucks a month of each other and I'm basing that off of 15 years in this industry. That's my opinion and although certain brands claim superiority on everything from energy effiencty to "the most comfortable spa", no one (including Watkins ) holds the title just yet.
Power consumption is one thing with spa's, but how long with all this green building stuff going on till it hits the small builders, and probably some large ones as well. I am not talking about the spa itself, but how the spa is built? I know Jacuzzi and Sundance spent a few million on a air handling system, I am sure HS has as well. I remember going to the Artesian's factory n Victorville, Ca the place smelled of resin/epoxy and guys were hand rolling fiberglass on the shell of the spa with no mask/ventilation what so ever. That probably has changed with their new factory? I am sure there are a lot of other smaller places building spa's with little or no regard for the environment and I would imagine the government will catch up to them at some point? Thoughts?? Same question to the Canadians
thats a big reason why so many mfgs are leaving california. Olhausen billiards left for many reasons and keeping things clean as possible is one thing where its hard for companies to do without spending big chunks of money.i hope its better in NV for Artesian now because i remember that smell and it was horrid
Could have been why they built in Nevada in stead of Ca, that or property cost? I remember someone telling me that if a spa manufacturer wants to build a factory in California,they have to double or triple the quality of air handling system than the last guy that built, something along those lines? Either way, it must be hell to try and build a factory in Ca and tell them you want to manufacture something!!
mmmm not 100% true.We have meter tested spas in our area for about 6 years and at one point we had Sundance, Artesian, Catalina and Hotspring spas on our floor and of the 4 comparable sized and option featured spas (ie circ pump, insulation types etc..) our Hotspring line was $10 - $25 cheaper to operate than any of the others. But then of course this will always vary depending on where you live etc.every now and then any spa manufacture will have a bad egg here and there which can lead to some pretty harsh brand bashing.But ultimately its what the customer finds is important to them not all the spa jargin that we tend to ramble off at themand no one will probably EVER hold ANY of those "official" titles until there is a nation wide standard.but as of now there are some companies that do more than others to show their customers that they are selling an energy efficient product.
James; can I ask why you have this intense curiosity on Arctic specifically? As a Caldera dealer, is this for ammunition to sell against them? :-? Can I ask what studies are available to US from Caldera to show a comparison in efficiency?Arctic seems to be one of the few manufacturers that has done outside testing on their spas (info has been available to the general public for years) and has gone through the expense of building a low-temperature test chamber at the plant.With all due respect to Arctic and yourself, most any major brand has very similar operating costs within a few $ a month of each other. Really a moot point... :-/And for the record, EVERY manufacturer claims superior energy efficiency... nothing new there...
Goarctic, thanks for starting this thread, it seems to be bringing a lot of good queries.If I don't answer a question right away, it doesn't mean I'm "glossing over it" or ignoring it. I try to make time to check the forums once a day but sometimes I have job deadlines that prevent that. Please, I ask your patience and forbearance.As I said, that's okay. I might sound a little harried in the paragraph above. Actually, I am. These are good and interesting questions. When our factory was TUV certified (TUV is the European version of UL, ETL, or CSA), the TUV people had a Canadian associate engineer who drove out to inspect the factory and filled in a bunch of forms. Based on his report, TUV issued the certificate. Perhaps the CEC certification is similar? I'll get back to you. I'll have to find out. TUV did this. The certificate is posted on the TUV site and anyone can view it. I know you're curious. Go to http://tuvamerica.com/tools/clientlists/certs.cfm and search for Blue Falls Manufacturing in the category Certificate Holder. You will find three certificates under our name. Click to view each in turn.Are you referring to the ASPA Growth Initiative? Arctic has contributed financially (we're top of the right hand column here http://www.apsp.org/210/index.aspx) and our VP Marketing serves on the steering committee. On another matter, we have some 250 dealers in 24 countries. That is small compared to other companies, but does give us a recognizable presence. And we're still growing. We have made a splash in Canada (we have been recognized as one of Canada's 50 Best Managed companies) and have won a couple of International Business Awards (one was for Best Designer). But we really don't make a big deal of these - our awards are not prominently displayed on our web site and are a little hard to find.Soak-king - When the CEC standards were first released, we checked our test data against the CEC figures and we were well above their requirements. It is our opinion that the CEC ambient test temperature is far too warm, and we are urging the Canadian government to adopt a standard with an ambient more representative of the Canadian climate. The mean annual temperature here is 7C (40F) compared to the 15C (60F) used in the CEC standard. The mean winter temperature is -12C (10F). We support the lower temperature and test to that standard.Whew! Have I answered everybody's questions?
That said I am a little dubious of a CEC certified testing facility in Canada. It just doesn’t sound right. Let me know otherwise and I’ll be happy to eat crow.
That's my opinion and although certain brands claim superiority on everything from energy effiencty to "the most comfortable spa", no one (including Watkins ) holds the title just yet.